152 replies to this topic

[johnpreuss]

No Brett, maybe , what alternative yeast? Thinking DuPont strain or another idea

[positiveContact]

I still need to make the last comm brew :lol:maybe this fall.

[ChefLamont]

I dont like rye. Or at most in small quantities. I will hang with the party until a lot of rye shows up....then I'm out.My last tripel was brewed with palm sugar. I did it based on a presentation at NHC a couple of years ago where a guy did a discussion on tripel sugars and brewed five tripels with different sugars. I recalled liking the palm sugar one the best, so I used it. So far so good, but it is not done and carbed yet.

[brewman]

We should make BL so we can boil it down and use it as water to brew something else.Dan

[armagh]

Thinking DuPont strain or another idea

A lot of brewers get frustrated using 3724/565. Whether it's trepidation about fermenting at warmer-than-normal temperatures or just not being used to longer ferments is hard to say. The Ardennes strains work a little more predictably and they'll create a Saisonish profile.

[MtnBrewer]

OK we can put wheat in the recipe with an option to use rye instead.We can specify 3724 with an option to use 3522 and/or Brett.But the dry hops are not gonna be optional dammit!j/k

[johnpreuss]

A lot of brewers get frustrated using 3724/565. Whether it's trepidation about fermenting at warmer-than-normal temperatures or just not being used to longer ferments is hard to say. The Ardennes strains work a little more predictably and they'll create a Saisonish profile.

I've had nothing but good luck with 565 BUT I have read a ton about the problems others have had. I would just like to stay away from 3711 - good performer but I'm not impressed by the flavor. Ardeness sounds like a great new idea, only problem is I don't have Wyeast available locally - Mr. Malty is saying WLP 550 is the same thing, does anyone want to vouch for that?

[Corbin]

Saison or hoppy american wheat or somekind of farm house ale with some crazy adjuncts

I am thinking Belgian and pale with some twist, maybe some fancy raw sugars?

As long as it is not a traditional basic one I am game. I want something unique.

Maybe add some......................................basil?

[Mindblock]

I've had nothing but good luck with 565 BUT I have read a ton about the problems others have had. I would just like to stay away from 3711 - good performer but I'm not impressed by the flavor. Ardeness sounds like a great new idea, only problem is I don't have Wyeast available locally - Mr. Malty is saying WLP 550 is the same thing, does anyone want to vouch for that?

This is why after fermenting the same wort side by side, from my perspective WLP566 (Saison II.....the "other DuPont strain) is close enough in flavor profile to 565 without the fussiness many people encounter with 565 fermentations.....566 just ferments and doesn't need to be coaxed and cajoled.....it also makes something that actually tastes good, unlike my experience with 3711.....I won't use it any more either.

Maybe add some......................................basil?

OK I see where you are going.....how about a straight up saison, with an addition of some Lemon Grass and Thai Basil (and perhaps a pound or two of orange blossom honey) added at 180F during the chill cycle, and held there for 15 minutes or so......finish chilling, oxygenate, and pitch a nice hungry dose of 566 and watch out.....<G> HMMM.....what hops to use and how much?????

[armagh]

I've had nothing but good luck with 565 BUT I have read a ton about the problems others have had. I would just like to stay away from 3711 - good performer but I'm not impressed by the flavor. Ardeness sounds like a great new idea, only problem is I don't have Wyeast available locally - Mr. Malty is saying WLP 550 is the same thing, does anyone want to vouch for that?

I'll vouch for it. I use them interchangably with no discernable difference. Like you, I have no trouble with 3724/565, but it seems to cause angst in some circles.

[MtnBrewer]

I'll vouch for it. I use them interchangably with no discernable difference. Like you, I have no trouble with 3724/565, but it seems to cause angst in some circles.

It does but it's worth it to me. Treat it right and it gives you (imo) the best saison flavors. Farmhouse is also good though and a little less finicky.

[Mindblock]

I'll vouch for it. I use them interchangably with no discernable difference. Like you, I have no trouble with 3724/565, but it seems to cause angst in some circles.

I can vouch for 565 and 566 being close enough, but I wouldn't put the other Belgian ale yeasts into that same category.....at least in this brewery, fermentation with 550 is WAY different than 565 or 566 as is the flavor profile of the resulting beer.....

It does but it's worth it to me. Treat it right and it gives you (imo) the best saison flavors. Farmhouse is also good though and a little less finicky.

I agree fully with this assessment, and I often find it worth the extra trouble to squeeze out those third and fourth level flavors from Saisons.....I cannot get anywhere near there with 3711, but consider 566 to be close enough for most stuff without the babysitting I give 565 fermentations. As always, YMMV.....

[armagh]

I can vouch for 565 and 566 being close enough, but I wouldn't put the other Belgian ale yeasts into that same category.....at least in this brewery, fermentation with 550 is WAY different than 565 or 566 as is the flavor profile of the resulting beer.....

The question, as I understood it, was whether WY3522 and WLP550 (Ardennes strains) are, as Mr. Malty states, the same, not whether 550 has equivalency with any of the other WLP strains.

[Mindblock]

The question, as I understood it, was whether WY3522 and WLP550 (Ardennes strains) are, as Mr. Malty states, the same, not whether 550 has equivalency with any of the other WLP strains.

My bad.....I was reading too quickly and had the whole Saison thing in the front of my mind.....SORRY!!

[armagh]

My bad.....I was reading too quickly and had the whole Saison thing in the front of my mind.....SORRY!!

No worries.

[Mya]

Proposed recipe outline60% Pils Malt 20% Rye20% Exotic Sugar of your choice (Palm for me)35 IBU of Spicy Noble Hops, with optional Dry HopBelgian Yeast of your choice

[matt6150]

I think I would be in for this. I'm not much of a Belgian fan but I'll drink them in moderation. I like the idea of the rye, I like rye. I have some 3655 yeast that I recently won so I would use that. I know nothing about it, so hopefully its a good yeast. I've actually never brewed a Belgian.

[MtnBrewer]

Proposed recipe outline60% Pils Malt20% Rye or wheat20% Exotic Sugar of your choice (Palm for me)35 IBU of Spicy Noble Hops, with optional Dry HopBelgian Yeast of your choice

FTFY...someone was saying they didn't like rye so an option should exist for the more traditional grain bill.I would suggest something neutral for bittering (Bravo, Apollo, Magnum, Target, etc.) and then Saaz or Tettnanger for aroma. Or, probably what I'm going to do, combine noble hops with American varieties derived from nobles, like Sterling, Mt. Hood, Santiam, etc.

[Mya]

FTFY...someone was saying they didn't like rye so an option should exist for the more traditional grain bill.I would suggest something neutral for bittering (Bravo, Apollo, Magnum, Target, etc.) and then Saaz or Tettnanger for aroma. Or, probably what I'm going to do, combine noble hops with American varieties derived from nobles, like Sterling, Mt. Hood, Santiam, etc.

I was thinking Magnum and Sterling

[neddles]

I could get on board with this. Is there a recommended online source for the palm sugar? How about a proposed OG or are we leaving that up to the brewer too?In an effort to experience more yeasts I could see me splitting the batch between 3522 and 3724.