483 replies to this topic

[Big Nake]

I know I've mentioned it (probably somewhere on these 20 pages) that the balance can be tricky to dial in. Any number of things can throw the balance out of whack and although the recipe is as simple and straightforward as it can be, if your water is not right or you use a lower-attenuating yeast, your mash temp is too high, etc., you can end up with something unsavory. If you think the water is what's causing the problem, here is my water again...


Calcium: 34
Sodium: 13
Magnesium: 12
Total Hardness: 135
Sulfate, SO4-S: 9
Chloride: 21
Bicarbonate, HCO3: 138
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3: 113


Don't use chloride-heavy water, balanced water is the best and you can see that nothing is really elevated except the bicarbonate (much to my dismay). If you use super-soft water, you'd probably want to try to get the numbers in line with these with additions. I just went downstairs and took a hit off the airlock and I'm swooning.

Edited by KenLenard, 05 December 2012 - 07:43 AM.

[HVB]

Next time I make it I will try tweaking my water to what you have Ken. This is what I was using, my water unaltered. Calcium 26 Magnesium 3 Sodium 19 Sulfate 12 Chloride 29 Bicarbonate 68.3 Total Hardness 77 Alkalinity 56 SO4/CL 0.4

[Big Nake]

I would say that you're lucky to have that water. Bicarb that is half of mine with other numbers nicely balanced. The calcium is low (as is mine) and if you believe that 50ppm is the minimum threshold, it can be a struggle to figure out how to raise it. But your chloride is over double your sulfate and (... Cl:SO4 ratio be damned!) that might be the problem. Have your attempts to make this beer ended up too malty? It looks like 1g of gypsum in the mash would get you to 30ppm overall which could make it just right. Remember too... my sulfate number (9) is expressed as SO4-S which means it's actually multiplied by three (27) so my tap water has just a smidge more sulfate than chloride. I'll say it again and then zip my mouth... I think water has a lot more to do with how beer comes out than homebrewers would like to admit. Those with very soft water probably easily learned that they could make soft styles like pilsner with their water and add gypsum to their water for things like IPAs and then just wash their hands of it.

[HVB]

Now that you mention it, I do remember one being very malty, one was bad because of an infection. Over this year I have been playing a lot with adjusting my water so I agree with you there. I enjoy hop forward beers and find I have to adjust to get the hops to "pop." I will give this one another try soon with the water adjustments.

Edited by drez77, 05 December 2012 - 08:17 AM.

[Big Nake]

Update: This beer was force-carbed over the weekend and I drew a sample from the keg last night. Perfect & just as I remember brewing it before I started futzing with my water. My conclusion is that regardless of who says that you need 50ppm of calcium or whatever, the bottom line is that for beers that are in this SRM range (maybe 10-15), I have no reason to adjust my water. This beer was made with 100% filtered tap water and no water additions at all. So my numbers were Ca 34, Mg 12, Na 13, Cl 21, SO4 27 and HCO3 138. That tells me that the only beers I need to worry about in terms of water are those under 5 and possibly those between 6 and 9. Pale ales, Ambers, Reds, possibly Oktobers, etc. will all be made with straight filtered tap water and no additions. Cheers! Ps. Those of you who have tried to make it and struck out... it occurs to me that if your water is not like mine, your MLPA is not tasting like mine. If your water is softer, the beer might be bland and if your water is harder, it may be harsh or something. When this particular beer is made with my water, it's a thing to behold! Cheers.

Edited by KenLenard, 23 January 2013 - 01:36 PM.

[Corbin]

So I jumped on the wagon. Brewed this a few weeks ago but used crystal 80. Bottled last night and warm and flat this is very tasty! Thanks for a great starting and finishing point for a beer. Will brew this many times but plan on tweaking also. Cheers!

[SchwanzBrewer]

I've brewed MLPA now about 15 times and I can say honestly that I've tried lowering the crystal weight, changing to another variety (40-80), but I keep coming back to the original recipe. The ONLY thing I do differently is use 1007. I think that yeast and the lagering for clearing makes the beer IMO. Simplicity is it's genius. Love that beer. Cheers, Rich

[Big Nake]

Simple is good. When I first started putting recipes together and then asking for feedback, I got a lot of... Why on Earth are you using so many different grains and why is the recipe so busy?... Know what you want and know how to get there. I realize that the hops are very low in contrast to what many homebrewers and beer geeks... er... craft beer enthusiasts prefer these days. I've passed this beer around to Miller Lite and Coors Light drinkers, homebrewers, friends, family, neighbors, beer snobs, etc. and other than my Dad (go figure), everyone raises their eyebrows and says, "Hey, nice beer!" and grabs another one. Cheers Beerheads.

[johnpreuss]

I actually plan to brew this exactly as you do, for once I will not stray.

[neddles]

The ingredients for this one arrived today. Going to make it as is with possibly a late and/or whirlpool addition of a small amount of the Mt. Hoods. My water is similar to yours Ken except it has less of everything. Might add some gypsum after I plug things into Brunwater. My Ca=9 and my SO4=9

[Big Nake]

My guess is that a lot of homebrewers have made this with a dizzying array of water profiles, grain bills and hop additions. Rich likes to make it with 1007 instead of 1056/WLP001. I have made it where I had an ounce of Mt. Hood at 6.1% (or whatever) and use 5.2 AAU at 60 and then just throw the rest in at flameout. It's a good springboard for whatever vision you have for it. Ettels, your water sounds "softer" to me. I thought my 34ppm of calcium were low but yours is truly low. If you make additions and get close to my water, you'll see what I have been drinking. But you could mix it up however you see fit and still make a great beer. Post back here and keep me posted on how these batches are coming out. Cheers!

[Big Nake]

MLPA is next up for me. I have some 1056 that will be coming out of a pale ale I made with Liberty and my plan is to brew tomorrow (Tue 3/5). Apparently there is a snowpocalypse bearing down on my area where 9-10" of snow is expected starting around 3am so this could be a wild brewday. Thank Jeebus I brew in the garage. Cheers gang.

[neddles]

Made this today. Dinked around with my water quite a bit in Brun'water to get things right. Mash@153F. A touch of unexpected efficiency gave me OG1.050 27BU's came from the following schedule 1.0oz@60 0.5oz@10 0.5oz post flameout @170F whirlpool for 15min. One of the easiest brew days ever.

[brewman]

I brewed my MLPA last Saturday and it was still bubbling a bit yesterday. I had a blowout with this beer on day 2 of fermentation but nothing major. Cant wait for this to be done. Dan

[Big Nake]

Made a batch of it yesterday. I also futzed with the water by cutting it 25% with distilled (to lower my bicarbonate) and then add back equal parts of gypsum and CaCl to get my calcium up to 50ppm overall. Otherwise, same recipe, 5.3AAUs of Mt. Hood at 60, 1056, etc.

[neddles]

Wow Ken I did the exact same thing with my water. Only difference was that I also added 1.5ml lactic acid to the mash. I brew in a bag (meaning full volume mash) which prevents acidification of the mash due to the thin mash.

[Big Nake]

Wow Ken I did the exact same thing with my water. Only difference was that I also added 1.5ml lactic acid to the mash. I brew in a bag (meaning full volume mash) which prevents acidification of the mash due to the thin mash.

I try to get as close as possible on mash pH with water, grains and whatever additions I make but I do have lactic acid at the ready in case the pH is a smidge high (if it's off, it's high... always high). On a batch I'm making today, (an SRM 5 pils/festbier sort of thing), no acid was necessary but I think my MLPA needed a few drops of acid. Cheers!

[neddles]

Kegged mine today. Finished @1.010. Probably gonna let it sit a good 3 weeks or so in the cold before I try it.

[Big Nake]

Kegged mine today. Finished @1.010. Probably gonna let it sit a good 3 weeks or so in the cold before I try it.

Yum. I have one in primary right now and it's probably close to done. It won't see the taps for quite awhile but I'm looking forward to it. I have a keg of it on tap 4 right now but I know it's about to go. Cheers!

[Corbin]

Hopefully you guys can help me out with this. I accidentally picked up a pound of gelatinized unmalted wheat for this recipe. I am brewing tonight and not able to correct this mistake. Will this make a huge difference from malted wheat?