313 replies to this topic

[positiveContact]

I was referring to the 5-10 mg/l the paper says to add at packaging.

 

oh - I missed that part.  my bad.

[Big Nake]

Brauer: Thanks for jumping in here again. I guess I'm thinking that I could benefit from handling things in a way where I don't introduce O2 as much as I do now but then possibly suffer a setback by adding something that I'm not used to using. If you think the SMB is "safe" for yeast, won't contribute any unusual flavors, etc., then I'll try it. If you envision using less or more, I would try it but I would be flying blind.

[Brauer]

Brauer: Thanks for jumping in here again. I guess I'm thinking that I could benefit from handling things in a way where I don't introduce O2 as much as I do now but then possibly suffer a setback by adding something that I'm not used to using. If you think the SMB is "safe" for yeast, won't contribute any unusual flavors, etc., then I'll try it. If you envision using less or more, I would try it but I would be flying blind.

From what I have experience with and what I've read, 5-15 ppm should be okay for brewing. I don't know anything about the 100 ppm that they suggest, other than that wine and cider brewers seem to use levels that high. They seem to be looking to inhibit wild yeasts but not Saccharomyces, but I don't really know anything about those processes.

The no observed adverse effect level for humans looks to be up over 500 mg\kg\day, though some percentage of the population appear to be sensitive to as little as a single 100 mg dose (these are probably the people that get sick from drinking white wine). It looks like you want to avoid skin exposure and inhalation.

[Big Nake]

One thing that just intrigues me a little is that I don't really concentrate on O2 pickup at all. I am careful after fermentation but none of these other ideas have been implemented by my brewery in the past, as I have mentioned. So my guess is that my beers are oxidized to some extent and because there are any number of spots to introduce O2 during the brewday, my guess is that my beers have ranged from "mildly oxidized" to "wildly oxidized". There could be some benefit here even if I don't follow the paper exactly or achieve total beer enlightenment as the paper suggests. Cheers.

[ChicagoWaterGuy]

The right consentration of SMB will kill all yeast and organisms but it disipates in a day. When you use it for wine making, you don't pitch your yeast until the day after you sulfite the juice.
Heat/boiling probably expidites the reaction so you can use smb in the mash but still be able to pitch after the boil.

[Big Nake]

The right consentration of SMB will kill all yeast and organisms but it disipates in a day. When you use it for wine making, you don't pitch your yeast until the day after you sulfite the juice.
Heat/boiling probably expidites the reaction so you can use smb in the mash but still be able to pitch after the boil.

Ooh, that's good. I did ask the guys on the GBF if the SMB gets burned off by heat (let's say you add it to the mash water you just boiled...) and it sounded like the SMB should be added once the mash water starts going down from boiling to strike temps. Cheers & thanks.

EDIT: So that suggests that any O2-scrubbing protection you might get from the SMB is not available to help you once you're past the boil point. So chilling and then racking to primary are a little more dicey, right?

[ChicagoWaterGuy]

Ooh, that's good. I did ask the guys on the GBF if the SMB gets burned off by heat (let's say you add it to the mash water you just boiled...) and it sounded like the SMB should be added once the mash water starts going down from boiling to strike temps. Cheers & thanks.

EDIT: So that suggests that any O2-scrubbing protection you might get from the SMB is not available to help you once you're past the boil point. So chilling and then racking to primary are a little more dicey, right?

You're literally minutes from hitting it with oxygen so I doubt it matters much. I guess a cheat would be to pitch your yeast in the kettle then rack into the fermenter. 

[HVB]

LOL .. so I guess we are not liked that much by a certain group

 

[positiveContact]

It's like we are in bizarro world here.  Do I need to replace evil morty with regular morty?

[Steve Urquell]

I think it was easy to misunderstand what they were saying as an attack on 99.5% brewers. It was easy to read their ideas as: "You've been doing it wrong and if you can't understand 'IT' then hey, your tastebuds suck and so does your beer."

 

I was removed from the Advanced German brewing forum but had stopped reading it altogether due to all of the "It" discussion. The tipping point for me was when someone was claiming that they had found a way to get "IT" by mashing at ~10+ different temperatures. Sounded like the mash would take you hours to complete. All I could think was that real German brewers would be laughing their asses off if they heard that crap.

 

Maybe it has some merit even if all that comes out of it is brewtan being used to make better beer. I've spent a lot of thought on uncomplicating my brewday but still making good beer. There was a time when my brewdays were so long that I was ready to give it up and I'm not willing to go back to that.

[denny]

LOL .. so I guess we are not liked that much by a certain group

 

 

I take that as a badge of honor.  And if those are the only places they're seeing negative comments, they aren't looking very hard!

I think it was easy to misunderstand what they were saying as an attack on 99.5% brewers. It was easy to read their ideas as: "You've been doing it wrong and if you can't understand 'IT' then hey, your tastebuds suck and so does your beer."

 

I was removed from the Advanced German brewing forum but had stopped reading it altogether due to all of the "It" discussion. The tipping point for me was when someone was claiming that they had found a way to get "IT" by mashing at ~10+ different temperatures. Sounded like the mash would take you hours to complete. All I could think was that real German brewers would be laughing their asses off if they heard that crap.

 

Maybe it has some merit even if all that comes out of it is brewtan being used to make better beer. I've spent a lot of thought on uncomplicating my brewday but still making good beer. There was a time when my brewdays were so long that I was ready to give it up and I'm not willing to go back to that.

 

Both the German and Czech brewers I spoke with were laughing their asses off about it.

[HVB]

I think it was easy to misunderstand what they were saying as an attack on 99.5% brewers. It was easy to read their ideas as: "You've been doing it wrong and if you can't understand 'IT' then hey, your tastebuds suck and so does your beer."

 

I was removed from the Advanced German brewing forum but had stopped reading it altogether due to all of the "It" discussion. The tipping point for me was when someone was claiming that they had found a way to get "IT" by mashing at ~10+ different temperatures. Sounded like the mash would take you hours to complete. All I could think was that real German brewers would be laughing their asses off if they heard that crap.

 

Maybe it has some merit even if all that comes out of it is brewtan being used to make better beer. I've spent a lot of thought on uncomplicating my brewday but still making good beer. There was a time when my brewdays were so long that I was ready to give it up and I'm not willing to go back to that.

I do not check it very much an the only reason I do is to see some pictures of German beer and locations.  But then I get really thirsty!

 

ETA:  I saw that mashing regime on there or maybe the other German Forum.  I think that mash would take longer than my entire brewday!

Edited by drez77, 26 May 2016 - 11:01 AM.

[SchwanzBrewer]

It took me all of about 1 discussion to be berated by someone in that group. I enjoy the beer porn there, but I don't comment much (or read the comments).

Edited by SchwanzBrewer, 26 May 2016 - 11:06 AM.

[neddles]

I've never been there at all, and consequently my beer sux. 

[Steve Urquell]

I've never been there at all, and consequently my beer sux. 

Oh noes, how will you ever get "IT"?

[positiveContact]

It took me all of about 1 discussion to be berated by someone in that group. I enjoy the beer porn there, but I don't comment much (or read the comments).

 

which is surprising considering I rarely see you or anyone else in the brews-bros beer forum berate or get berated by anyone for anything.  the PH is another matter all together

Edited by Evil_Morty, 26 May 2016 - 11:46 AM.

[neddles]

Both the German and Czech brewers I spoke with were laughing their asses off about it.

Denny, If you have access to knowledgeable German and Czech brewers why not put them on the podcast? Certainly you could discuss the low O2 thing but also discuss other common brewing practices over there and how they might be utilized by us American homebrewing rubes.

[denny]

Denny, If you have access to knowledgeable German and Czech brewers why not put them on the podcast? Certainly you could discuss the low O2 thing but also discuss other common brewing practices over there and how they might be utilized by us American homebrewing rubes.

 

That's a possibility.

[SchwanzBrewer]

That's a possibility.

 

DO EEET!

[positiveContact]

That's a possibility.

 

liking the sound of that!