517 replies to this topic

[Brauer]

I posted that to show how easy it is to believe what you think you are experiencing and tasting. I would have sworn that my beer was completely changed had I not tasted it side-by-side with my other batch.

One thing I noticed in going back and forth between 2 glasses is that after a couple of sips it became harder to discern differences in the two. I'll do another where I only taste the difference once and see if I hit it multi times in a row with an hour between tastings.

Either way, any difference must be very slight for it to be so difficult to detect in a side-by-side.

It is amazing how a difference can seem so convincing until compared blindly to an appropriate control. Most scientists have that "a-ha" moment at some point, then realize why it is so important to have controls.

[denny]

I posted that to show how easy it is to believe what you think you are experiencing and tasting. I would have sworn that my beer was completely changed had I not tasted it side-by-side with my other batch.

 

One thing I noticed in going back and forth between 2 glasses is that after a couple of sips it became harder to discern differences in the two.  I'll do another where I only taste the difference once and see if I hit it multi times in a row with an hour between tastings.

 

When I do my recipe design and evaluation seminar, I cite maybe 4-5 different confirmation bias studies.  I'd be happy to post that part here if anyone is interested in seeing it.

[MyaCullen]

post away!

 

 

My issue with their process is the massive doses of sodium they are dumping into the beer, no wonder they get a sweeter taste, blech.

[matt6150]

Well crap. I have a non-brewtan rye pale ale on tap right now that I brewed a month ago. Brewing the same recipe today so I could compare but forgot the brewtan. I guess that's what I get for mashing in this morning at 6 after 4 hours of sleep.

[Steve Urquell]

Well crap. I have a non-brewtan rye pale ale on tap right now that I brewed a month ago. Brewing the same recipe today so I could compare but forgot the brewtan. I guess that's what I get for mashing in this morning at 6 after 4 hours of sleep.

I got on a roll of forgetting my 175F whirlpool addition until I had chilled too far. Started putting a note taped to the counter sticking straight out/off the edge to remind me. I'll also sit stuff on top of my tun so I don't forget it. Getting old sucks.

[denny]

post away!

 

 

My issue with their process is the massive doses of sodium they are dumping into the beer, no wonder they get a sweeter taste, blech.

 

Here's a link that I hope will work.  Confirmation bias info starts on pg. 41.  Lemme know if you need explanations since I usually do that with the slides.

 

httpss://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2R-Uk7z3JpgMHRHcnRLWmpRUG8/view?usp=sharing

Edited by denny, 31 July 2016 - 09:01 AM.

[EnkAMania]

I measured 1/2 tsp at 1.05 grams.  The instructions I got on the package say 2-5 g per hectolitre.   So I'm splitting the difference and will use 3.5 g per hectolitre.  I believe a 5.5 gallon batch is about .21 hectolitre.  So that is roughly .75 g for my 5.5 batch.  

[Big Nake]

I measured 1/2 tsp at 1.05 grams.  The instructions I got on the package say 2-5 g per hectolitre.   So I'm splitting the difference and will use 3.5 g per hectolitre.  I believe a 5.5 gallon batch is about .21 hectolitre.  So that is roughly .75 g for my 5.5 batch.

We've been doing ¼ tsp in the mash water and then ½ tsp mixed with a small amount of water and added in the last 15 minutes of the boil. Some of the data that is put out by Ajinimoto differs from how some of the homebrewers have determined that it works best. I have been following this ¼ tsp, ½ tsp thing and yesterday I made my 10th or 11th batch of brewtan beer and every one so far has been really, really good.

[Steve Urquell]

Brewing my ALL recipe today with brewtan. No low pH on this one but I do have the pink foam Ken reported. On the pH--I was using a new scale on that low pH batch and could have had it set to lbs rather than ozs when measuring out my acid malt. .4lbs is >4ozs.

[positiveContact]

We've been doing ¼ tsp in the mash water and then ½ tsp mixed with a small amount of water and added in the last 15 minutes of the boil. Some of the data that is put out by Ajinimoto differs from how some of the homebrewers have determined that it works best. I have been following this ¼ tsp, ½ tsp thing and yesterday I made my 10th or 11th batch of brewtan beer and every one so far has been really, really good.

 

how can you differentiate this from normal though?

 

so is anyone at AHA or anywhere else trying this stuff and reporting anything back?  any triangle tests?

[denny]

how can you differentiate this from normal though?
 
so is anyone at AHA or anywhere else trying this stuff and reporting anything back?  any triangle tests?

Several people are using it but no triangle tests yet.

[neddles]

Denny, do you know... what is the guidance on using it with whirlfloc/finings? Add before, after or along with whirlfloc or does it make no difference? I usually add whirlfloc @10 and have added the Brewtan B @15 in these batches.

[HVB]

Denny, do you know... what is the guidance on using it with whirlfloc/finings? Add before, after or along with whirlfloc or does it make no difference? I usually add whirlfloc @10 and have added the Brewtan B @15 in these batches.

Out of ease of brewday I have been adding it when I add whirlfloc.  That is except for the last batch that I left out whirlfloc to go for a really hazy NEIPA

[Big Nake]

Brewtan between 10 and 15 left in the boil, whirfloc tablet with 7 minutes left (after a bunch of reading where someone supposedly found the kill zone for whirfloc). As for how do I know whether the brewtan is making a difference or not... I don't. My tastebuds tell me that there is a difference based on recipes I have been brewing for years. Someone on AHA said something to the effect of, "This stuff is making my beer better and I don't need a triangle test to tell me that!" which I thought was excellent. Still, cautious is the way to go and I can't say one way or the other but at some point some testing will be done and we will have more understanding of what is (or what is not) happening with brewtan. In the meantime, I'm using it.

[HVB]

Brewtan between 10 and 15 left in the boil, whirfloc tablet with 7 minutes left (after a bunch of reading where someone supposedly found the kill zone for whirfloc). As for how do I know whether the brewtan is making a difference or not... I don't. My tastebuds tell me that there is a difference based on recipes I have been brewing for years. Someone on AHA said something to the effect of, "This stuff is making my beer better and I don't need a triangle test to tell me that!" which I thought was excellent. Still, cautious is the way to go and I can't say one way or the other but at some point some testing will be done and we will have more understanding of what is (or what is not) happening with brewtan. In the meantime, I'm using it.

I wonder how that 7 minute time changes when you add in a whirlpool.

[Big Nake]

I wonder how that 7 minute time changes when you add in a whirlpool.

I've heard a lot about people using half of a tablet (1 tablet is for 10 gallons apparently) and how it works based on 5 minutes, 10 minutes, etc. in the boil. I think I was doing either 5 or 10 minutes. Could its magic wear off if it were in the boil too long? Once you get the kettle below the boiling point (like whirlpooling) are you safe from that? No idea. The seven minute addition has given me great results. Is brewtan supposed to help settle things or create less break material or maybe compact the break matieral better? I can't remember everything I've read but my break material has been very compact lately which makes running off to the primary a lot easier. When I made this altbier on Saturday, I got almost 5 complete gallons of crystal-clear wort which is unusual.

[Steve Urquell]

I just did the blind side-by-side comparo again and cannot tell a difference in the BT and Non-BT German beers. I have a tiny amount of my non-BT light beer left in the keg. Probably a pint or less. I'll compare it to the finished light beer I brewed today although I don't think it's in great shape--traveled to a party, jumped keg and nearly empty.

[denny]

Denny, do you know... what is the guidance on using it with whirlfloc/finings? Add before, after or along with whirlfloc or does it make no difference? I usually add whirlfloc @10 and have added the Brewtan B @15 in these batches.

 

Add it before other finings is what Joe told me.  I use Brewtan at 15 min. to flameout and Whirlfloc at 5 to flameout.

I've heard a lot about people using half of a tablet (1 tablet is for 10 gallons apparently) and how it works based on 5 minutes, 10 minutes, etc. in the boil. I think I was doing either 5 or 10 minutes. Could its magic wear off if it were in the boil too long? Once you get the kettle below the boiling point (like whirlpooling) are you safe from that? No idea. The seven minute addition has given me great results. Is brewtan supposed to help settle things or create less break material or maybe compact the break matieral better? I can't remember everything I've read but my break material has been very compact lately which makes running off to the primary a lot easier. When I made this altbier on Saturday, I got almost 5 complete gallons of crystal-clear wort which is unusual.

 

I use 1/2 tab at 5 min. and I'm very satisfied with how it works.  Supposedly, if you boil it too long you denature it.  I think you add Brewtan first so the Whirlfloc doesn't bind it up and make it useless.

I just did the blind side-by-side comparo again and cannot tell a difference in the BT and Non-BT German beers. I have a tiny amount of my non-BT light beer left in the keg. Probably a pint or less. I'll compare it to the finished light beer I brewed today although I don't think it's in great shape--traveled to a party, jumped keg and nearly empty.

 

Thanks.  I really need to do this.

[EnkAMania]

Add it before other finings is what Joe told me.  I use Brewtan at 15 min. to flameout and Whirlfloc at 5 to flameout.

 

Whoops, I did that backwards

[Big Nake]

I just did the blind side-by-side comparo again and cannot tell a difference in the BT and Non-BT German beers. I have a tiny amount of my non-BT light beer left in the keg. Probably a pint or less. I'll compare it to the finished light beer I brewed today although I don't think it's in great shape--traveled to a party, jumped keg and nearly empty.

I guess I would go back to something I thought was a possibility before... 1) you were getting less O2 in your beers to begin with. Brewtan is doing the same thing for you as it is for me but it's more noticeable to me because I was getting more O2 pickup than you. 2) What about this "metal-chelating" thing? Could my water be causing issues that yours does not and brewtan is fixing that problem where you had no problem to fix? 3) It's possible that the difference I'm seeing is from switching from a copper chiller to an SS one, conditioning the malt and going directly from primary to keg instead of a secondary and the brewtan is actually making no difference. Any of those could be nonsense and I could be full of shizz too.