47 replies to this topic

[johnpreuss]

Ok so I'm planning an IPA in the future. Hops I have to play with on this brew will be Columbus, Centennial, Simcoe and Delta(I'm going to call it a Cascade sub from experience). I really like Cele and Ruthless Rye. I'd like to have the mouthfeel of those beers but not necessarily either of those. I'm not sure where to start other than I have a sack of 2 row and that'll be the base .

[MtnBrewer]

Malt:
95% Pale malt
5% Med. crystal

Hops:
Columbus (60) - 70 IBUs
Centennial & Delta (45) - 15 IBUs (~0.25 oz. each)
Centennial & Delta (30) - 12 IBUs (~0.25 oz. each)
Simcoe, Centennial & Columbus (whirlpool) - 0.5 - 1 oz. each
Centennial, Simcoe, Delta & Columbus (dry) - 1 oz. each

Yeast:
Chico or other clean American yeast

Note: Hops amounts assume a 5 gallon batch, scale accordingly.

OG: 1.068
After fermentation halts, hold for 2 days, then crash cool to 50F and rack or drop yeast. Dry hop for 10 days then rack again and package.

[johnpreuss]

Hmm... do you think 1272/wlp051 is clean enough? I do prefer it over 1056/001 because if flocs so nicely. 6 gallon batch is my norm but if I took the OG down a bit the IBUs should be ok right?

[MtnBrewer]

Yes 1272 would be great, I prefer it to 1056 also. 1450 would be another good choice. Just scale for a 6 gallon batch instead of a 5 gallon batch. Leave the OG alone.

[BlKtRe]

I personally think the whirlpool is way over rated. At least the benefit vs cost is outrageous. I have to add double sometimes triple the hops in whirlpool to get the same flavor as a 20, 10, hopback or a 15, 5, hopback. Hopback can be flameout, whirlpool whatever you want to call it. Im getting away from the Mitch Steele way of thinking. Its just to expensive for me.

[MtnBrewer]

You can add the whirlpool at knockout if you like.

[djinkc]

I personally think the whirlpool is way over rated. At least the benefit vs cost is outrageous. I have to add double sometimes triple the hops in whirlpool to get the same flavor as a 20, 10, hopback or a 15, 5, hopback. Hopback can be flameout, whirlpool whatever you want to call it. Im getting away from the Mitch Steele way of thinking. Its just to expensive for me.

I haven't gotten very far in Steele's book yet so I don't know what he's espousing. I've been really happy with 175df additions though. I'm getting way more bang for the buck vs. FO additions. Honestly, I'll probably never do a FO addition again.

[johnpreuss]

I've tried both flameout and whirlpool several times and get pretty much the same results, I just let the flame out sit and steep for 15-20 minutes it's easier than watching the temp as I chill.

[johnpreuss]

Yes 1272 would be great, I prefer it to 1056 also. 1450 would be another good choice. Just scale for a 6 gallon batch instead of a 5 gallon batch. Leave the OG alone.

OK! I'll leave the OG alone! LOL

I'm in a White Labs town so 1450 is out. Sad..

Edited by johnpreuss, 12 March 2013 - 05:20 PM.

[BlKtRe]

I haven't gotten very far in Steele's book yet so I don't know what he's espousing. I've been really happy with 175df additions though. I'm getting way more bang for the buck vs. FO additions. Honestly, I'll probably never do a FO addition again.

Technically Ive been doing the 175* addition since I started brewing with my hopback 8 yrs ago. So I'm finding out its not new to me. Now adding the majority of the flavor/aroma hops at whirlpool is whats written in the book. That is what I'm not buying into any longer.

[djinkc]

I've tried both flameout and whirlpool several times and get pretty much the same results, I just let the flame out sit and steep for 15-20 minutes it's easier than watching the temp as I chill.

I think a lot of aromatics volatilize much more at flameout than dropping to 175. I know it has made a big difference the past several months at my place.

[djinkc]

Technically Ive been doing the 175* addition since I started brewing with my hopback 8 yrs ago. So I'm finding out its not new to me. Now adding the majority of the flavor/aroma hops at whirlpool is whats written in the book. That is what I'm not buying into any longer.

For the time being my 175 drop is done with the IC at flameout, then it gets pulled. Pellets hops are added, whirlpool and rest for 15 minutes. And they're also sitting in the kettle while wort goes throught the plate chiller into the fermenter. I'm sold on it for the time being. If I kick this cold's butt I'll bring some Thursday to the mtg

[johnpreuss]

UGGGHH! ok ok, I'll do the 175dF addition. I probably haven't been patient enough. 2 of my best APA's have been brews that I ran out of propane and I had to run and get more, ironically right after I added the 15 min addition and by the time I got back I was around 170df.

[djinkc]

UGGGHH! ok ok, I'll do the 175dF addition. I probably haven't been patient enough. 2 of my best APA's have been brews that I ran out of propane and I had to run and get more, ironically right after I added the 15 min addition and by the time I got back I was around 170df.

ah, just another way to try it, don't let me twist you arm

[johnpreuss]

Ok so that puts it @ 97 IBUs w/o the late additions. I understand why you said leave the OG alone. Explain to me the thoughts behind the 45 & 30 minute additions. I'm not use to seeing those.

[BlKtRe]

Ok so that puts it @ 97 IBUs w/o the late additions. I understand why you said leave the OG alone. Explain to me the thoughts behind the 45 & 30 minute additions. I'm not use to seeing those.

[BlKtRe]

Smooths the bitterness. A lot of the pro guys are doing this.

[MtnBrewer]

Smooths the bitterness. A lot of the pro guys are doing this.

This. There's two schools of thought. One is you dump all the bittering hops in at the beginning of the boil and all the aroma hops at the end (or whirlpool) and you get a very in-your-face bitterness up front, nice hop aromas at the end and it leaves room for some malt in the middle. This is sort of the Stone way of doing things. The other way is spread the hops out over the whole boil. The ultimate in this approach are the DFH 60/90/120 series. This way you get more hop complexity but sometimes it can get muddy if you're not careful and it tends to cover up the malt flavors to some degree. Neither way is right or wrong, it's just a matter of preference. My next IPA is going to have a big Magnum or Bravo charge at the beginning, a series of small Simcoe additions from 30 minutes on, some Centennial & Santiam at flameout and Amarillo for dry hopping.

Another thing you could consider is the Firestone Walker approach of two short (~3 days) dry hop additions instead of one longer one. The theory is that you get all you're going to get after just a few days and the only way to pack more hop aroma into the beer is to do multiple dry hops.

[BlKtRe]

This. There's two schools of thought. One is you dump all the bittering hops in at the beginning of the boil and all the aroma hops at the end (or whirlpool) and you get a very in-your-face bitterness up front, nice hop aromas at the end and it leaves room for some malt in the middle. This is sort of the Stone way of doing things. The other way is spread the hops out over the whole boil. The ultimate in this approach are the DFH 60/90/120 series. This way you get more hop complexity but sometimes it can get muddy if you're not careful and it tends to cover up the malt flavors to some degree. Neither way is right or wrong, it's just a matter of preference. My next IPA is going to have a big Magnum or Bravo charge at the beginning, a series of small Simcoe additions from 30 minutes on, some Centennial & Santiam at flameout and Amarillo for dry hopping.

Another thing you could consider is the Firestone Walker approach of two short (~3 days) dry hop additions instead of one longer one. The theory is that you get all you're going to get after just a few days and the only way to pack more hop aroma into the beer is to do multiple dry hops.

Well put.

Firestone's way of dry hopping is not a theory. It works and works well to keep the vegetation flavors out of the beer. Of course ambient temp plays into this too. Actually, a lot of West Coast breweries are dry hopping with this method. I have gotten lucky as one of the head brewers around here is family with a head brewer at Lost Abbey. I've been getting free advice on Sours and IpA because of this nice little benefit I just happened to walk into.

[MtnBrewer]

Firestone's way of dry hopping is not a theory.

Lighten up Francis. Just explaining the reasoning behind it because I know that was going to be the next question asked. Not trying to insinuate that it doesn't work.