69 replies to this topic

[positiveContact]

I've got some wyeast staro-prague lager yeast that I'll be using once my basement cools off enough to support lagers. I was thinking of starting off with a bohemian pilsner. It seems like a lot of people use decoction but I'm not really interested in doing that. I'd also like to do this with a single infusion. I've got some good quality german pils. I was figuring I'd use that for the base with just a touch of carafoam and aromatic. The hops would probably be all czech saaz although I might use magnum just for bittering or to enhance the bittering a bit (b/c magnum is pretty efficient for this purpose). I'll be posting a more specific recipe once I get some of the major aspects ironed out here. What do you guys typically do with this style?

Edited by StudsTerkel, 13 October 2011 - 08:04 AM.

[toonces]

pretty much everything you wrote.

[positiveContact]

pretty much everything you wrote.

well that's good I suppose...

[toonces]

we're either both right, or both wrong.

[Humperdink]

Both right in my book.

[Big Nake]

I like to add either Munich or Vienna to my BoPils which is something you can't/don't typically do with a German pilsner. I could see the Aromatic as a good ingredient as well. I made a few BoPils this past summer with the 2782 Staro yeast (as well as a Vienna & a Red Lager) and it is a dynamite yeast. I hate to bring it up but the one thing that comes to mind is water. If you are lucky enough to have ultra-soft water you're probably in good shape. My water is high enough in bicarbonate that it's unsuitable for a beer like this. Also, you could look into something like a Hochkurz mash where you go 142x30 and then 158x60. This is supposed to get you a more fermentable wort but still with a solid maltiness from the higher mash temp. Not single infusion but not decoction either.

[positiveContact]

I like to add either Munich or Vienna to my BoPils which is something you can't/don't typically do with a German pilsner. I could see the Aromatic as a good ingredient as well. I made a few BoPils this past summer with the 2782 Staro yeast (as well as a Vienna & a Red Lager) and it is a dynamite yeast. I hate to bring it up but the one thing that comes to mind is water. If you are lucky enough to have ultra-soft water you're probably in good shape. My water is high enough in bicarbonate that it's unsuitable for a beer like this. Also, you could look into something like a Hochkurz mash where you go 142x30 and then 158x60. This is supposed to get you a more fermentable wort but still with a solid maltiness from the higher mash temp. Not single infusion but not decoction either.

water is pretty soft so no problem. can you make those mash steps by just infusing boiling water or something?

[Big Nake]

water is pretty soft so no problem. can you make those mash steps by just infusing boiling water or something?

Yes. Start lower than usual and try to dial in 142-145°. Add boiling water until you reach about 158°. You will begin to thin out your mash so start thicker. Ending thin is okay for this style and apparently a German and/or Czech thing in normal practice. This is something that I have done but I will still just go with a single infusion at 150-151° for this style as well. Cheers.

[cavman]

I am thinking the staro yeast as it's listed temp range of 50-58(a little high for a lager strain) will make a nice altbier as well as lagers. I have some staro I just grew up on the stir plate that I plan on a Munich Dunkel to start and probably an alt at some point with it.

[positiveContact]

I am thinking the staro yeast as it's listed temp range of 50-58(a little high for a lager strain) will make a nice altbier as well as lagers. I have some staro I just grew up on the stir plate that I plan on a Munich Dunkel to start and probably an alt at some point with it.

you thinking the higher end of the temp range would work for an alt? never heard of anyone using a lager yeast for an alt...

[cavman]

you thinking the higher end of the temp range would work for an alt? never heard of anyone using a lager yeast for an alt...

the BJCP guidelines say to use a lager yeat for NG alts, and considering the clean yeast profile you look for in an dussy I don't see why not use a lager yeast.

[Big Nake]

The funny thing about this yeast is that my tastebuds have declared it decidedly "pilsner-y". My guess is that it is used primarily in pilsner production so the Vienna & the Red Lager I made both have that profile, IMO. Some people may not notice it but if you drank my Vienna or Red Lager and closed your eyes, you might guess that the beer was "gold". I also made a Helles with it that's still in secondary.

[positiveContact]

The funny thing about this yeast is that my tastebuds have declared it decidedly "pilsner-y". My guess is that it is used primarily in pilsner production so the Vienna & the Red Lager I made both have that profile, IMO. Some people may not notice it but if you drank my Vienna or Red Lager and closed your eyes, you might guess that the beer was "gold". I also made a Helles with it that's still in secondary.

sounds like I'm really going to like this yeast. Maybe I'll make your red lager as well. I'm figuring I'll get 4-5 beers out of this yeast. bopils and o'fest are already definite.

Edited by StudsTerkel, 16 October 2011 - 08:57 AM.

[Big Nake]

Yeah, I think I made an Ofest, a Vienna, one or two Pilsners and a Red Lager with it. Really nice yeast but it was time to move on to something else. Today I am moving 3 beers from primary to secondary (2 with White Labs 01 and one with 2782) and the 2782 is being retired with this batch. Cheers & good luck with the beers.

[positiveContact]

recipe:

8.5lbs pils
1/4lb aromatic
1/4lb carafoam
1lb munich

mash @ 151F (single infusion)

0.75oz saaz for 90 mins
0.5oz munich for 90 mins
1oz saaz for 15 mins
1oz saaz for 0 mins

OG: 1.053
SRM: 4
IBU: 41

ferment on wyeast 2782

now the tricky part...

here are my final water numbers for my mash. I need to pull that RA down but I don't want to harden up my water too much. How much calcium chloride and/or gypsum can I use to hit my RA without hurting the final product? Just to be clear I want to hit -44 but I'm at 18 right now.


httpss://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-IVBzLVpvHgQ/TvBxhkYq9JI/AAAAAAAALlc/RVQ4ZKrSIU0/s1029/mash.jpg

Edited by StudsTerkel, 20 December 2011 - 04:31 AM.

[positiveContact]

also - how about the hops? I really have no sense of how much saaz I should be throwing at this thing.

[positiveContact]

should I maybe be using acidulated malt?? also - something I never quite understood - if the calcium is really low isn't that bad for the yeast and for clarity?

[positiveContact]

anyone have any thoughts on my recipe and water profile here? I'm under the impression that my water is fairly soft.

[BlKtRe]

A tad bit of RB puts a sweet golden/orange color to it.

[positiveContact]

A tad bit of RB puts a sweet golden/orange color to it.

I'm fine with the SRM is but I've done this with other beers and it does work quite well. something dehusked would be even better. eta: I should probably check in designing great beers for this style - I can't recall if it's in there...

Edited by StudsTerkel, 20 December 2011 - 11:35 AM.