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#21 ER Pemberton

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 01:04 PM

I also think you need to make a video of your transfer process.

How do you avoid the pressure drop from the fermenter, do you let air in to allow the beer to flow? Creating a vacuum on you plastic fermenter isnt good. Its not as good in compression as it is in tension. Could be creating micro cracks for contaminants to form.

Look at the link I posted above.  It's in there.  This topic always gets people in a foam and it always has.  I get it.  Many people will be skeptical and many people would rather not reexamine what they've been doing in the past.  I'm not here to convince anybody of anything.  Try it or don't try it... it's that simple.  There are hundreds of brewers on that low-O2 forum doing this in one form or another.  For it to be confirmation bias it would have to be every one of them.  Some of the people over there are just humble beermakers like me but others are engineers who have more scientific credibility than I do.    



#22 SchwanzBrewer

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:14 PM

Look at the link I posted above.  It's in there.  This topic always gets people in a foam and it always has.  I get it.  Many people will be skeptical and many people would rather not reexamine what they've been doing in the past.  I'm not here to convince anybody of anything.  Try it or don't try it... it's that simple.  There are hundreds of brewers on that low-O2 forum doing this in one form or another.  For it to be confirmation bias it would have to be every one of them.  Some of the people over there are just humble beermakers like me but others are engineers who have more scientific credibility than I do.    

 

That's pretty much how confirmation bias works in an echo chamber. 

 

I couldn't see the pictures of the transfer on my phone or I didn't scroll down enough. On the computer now; I see it the transfer makes sense. Just have to have enough pressure in the keg to get all the beer moved over prior to equalizing the pressure. That's kind of neat. Again, there's no reason why you couldn't use a siphon though, just put a valve in the line on the hose  to prevent spillage during fermentation and do your process as normal. I'm just trying to help with your issue of ingress to the fermenter in a swamp cooler.

 

The real solution is obviously get a bigger fermentation fridge with multiple temperature control chambers so you don't run into this problem again.

 

O2 ingress aside, I've always thought through my own anecdotal tastings that beer that I've brewed that naturally carbonated tasted different, sometimes better, than it's force carbed counterpart. The biggest problem I have is that there are hundreds of variables to control to really give a good comparison and outside of a lab it's so hard to make a definitive statement. Do what your taste buds tell you to do.

 

You're mash cap needs better materials. Aluminum oxide on the foil will leach into the beer at mash PH.

 

Also I'm really surprised you haven't switched to BIAB yet to avoid sparging.


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#23 Zsasz

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:29 PM

Ultimate would be no sparge. Biab has wort dripping from the bag.
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#24 Zsasz

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:31 PM

The lodo guys sound like a cult to me. The scientologists of beer brewing.
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#25 HVB

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:37 PM

Ultimate would be no sparge. Biab has wort dripping from the bag.

I do no sparge biab in a separate kettle. Keeps the schmutz out of the kettle for me.

Eta yeah I know it is not really biab and more of no sparge but I do use the bag for easy cleanup.

Edited by drez77, 15 December 2018 - 03:39 PM.

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#26 Zsasz

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:45 PM

I do no sparge biab in a separate kettle. Keeps the schmutz out of the kettle for me.

Eta yeah I know it is not really biab and more of no sparge but I do use the bag for easy cleanup.

 

right on the ETA.  you aren't doing BIAB classic where you lift the bag and let the grain drain out.


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#27 HVB

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 03:57 PM

right on the ETA. you aren't doing BIAB classic where you lift the bag and let the grain drain out.


Correct, sometimes I do but not all the time.
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#28 SchwanzBrewer

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 04:24 PM

Ultimate would be no sparge. Biab has wort dripping from the bag.

 

If the bag is just barely at the level of the wort then you will get a very gentle release of wort from the bag.


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#29 djinkc

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 04:40 PM

The lodo guys sound like a cult to me. The scientologists of beer brewing.

 

I have to agree but they aren't hurting anyone.  And maybe they have a point but they still sound over the top.  A lot of world class beer has been brewed without following their ideas.


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#30 Zsasz

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 05:41 PM

If the bag is just barely at the level of the wort then you will get a very gentle release of wort from the bag.

 

any amount is too much for lodo!!!  don't bother if you aren't fully committed!


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#31 Bklmt2000

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 08:00 PM

Only took 3 posts to derail this thread away from ferm temp control to bashing low-O2.

 

Well done, guys.


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#32 neddles

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Posted 15 December 2018 - 10:33 PM

If the bag is just barely at the level of the wort then you will get a very gentle release of wort from the bag.


This. Keep the very bottom of the bag in the wort and you wont get splashing.
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#33 Zsasz

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 07:00 AM

Only took 3 posts to derail this thread away from ferm temp control to bashing low-O2.

 

Well done, guys.

 

my comments are only bashing if you don't believe.  BIAB with any wort dripping or exposed to O2 would be frowned upon by the LODO people.

 

but anyway - sorry to be part of the derailment.  my bad there.


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#34 Zsasz

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 09:18 AM

so now I feel bad for being part of the derailment.

 

do you think that wrapping it in insulation (blankets, bubble wrap, etc.) might keep it warm enough in the garage?  do you have any kind of box you could put it in in the garage and then maybe put one of those small space heaters in there with a temp controller?

 

you can get these space heaters pretty cheap at walmart usually: https://www.amazon.c...r/dp/B003XDTWN2


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#35 neddles

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 11:34 AM

Aquarium heaters are quite cheap. Pick one up at Walmart and use it to heat your swamp cooler.


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#36 Zsasz

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 12:12 PM

It sounds like he was trying to avoid a swamp cooler because of a possible leak at his spigot.
How about a plastic bag of some kind around the fermenter? Have anything waterproof?
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#37 HVB

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 12:52 PM

It sounds like he was trying to avoid a swamp cooler because of a possible leak at his spigot.
How about a plastic bag of some kind around the fermenter? Have anything waterproof?

A trash bag may work out ok.


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#38 ER Pemberton

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 02:00 PM

I chilled this wort well and then placed the fermenter in the tub and put a large (gallon?) frozen bottle in there and then covered it with a towel.  The tub is sitting on the concrete floor in my beer bunker.  My guess is that the fermentation will take place in the 58-60° range which is okay for 2112.  I have three large frozen water bottles that should be okay to rotate for the 4-5 days that this thing will be kept cool.  Thanks for the direction guys.  



#39 neddles

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 02:13 PM

It sounds like he was trying to avoid a swamp cooler because of a possible leak at his spigot.
How about a plastic bag of some kind around the fermenter? Have anything waterproof?

 

Doh, yeah forgot that part.


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#40 Zsasz

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Posted 16 December 2018 - 02:17 PM

I chilled this wort well and then placed the fermenter in the tub and put a large (gallon?) frozen bottle in there and then covered it with a towel.  The tub is sitting on the concrete floor in my beer bunker.  My guess is that the fermentation will take place in the 58-60° range which is okay for 2112.  I have three large frozen water bottles that should be okay to rotate for the 4-5 days that this thing will be kept cool.  Thanks for the direction guys.  

 

the other thing you could do is evaporative cooling with a towel and some water that doesn't go up to the spigot?  I dunno.


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