34 replies to this topic

[Kellermeister]

Base concept from Denny's recipe, otherwise from many batches of alt brewed and consumed.

[denny]

A recipe I posted, not necessarily my recipe. It's from the brewmaster at Zum Uerige.

[Brauer]

Here's the recipe for Zum Uerige from the brewmaster, via Denny, if you are interested:

Dr. Frank Hebmuller, who is the brew master and executive brewer at Zum Uerige:

Water can be relatively hard with a high carbonate level.

Malt is based on well modified pils, with a bit of caramel malt and a bit of "chocolate roasted wheat malt".

Mash schedule has rests at 125, 144, 158, and 169 (mashout).

Boil time is 60-70 min.

Mittelfruh, Perle, or Spalt are the preferred hops. Aroma hop addition is about 25% of the total hop amount. Add aroma hops no earlier than 20 min. before flameout.

OG is 1.044-1.052. FG should be 1.008-1.014. 4.3-5.5% ABV

Primary between 59-68F. Secondary at 50F. Then condition at 32F for 14 days.

Here's the ingredients with the Pilsner Malt scaled for 80% efficiency: 8.5 lb Pilsner Malt2.5 oz German CaraMunich III1.34 oz Chocolate Wheat Malt0.7 oz Hallertau Mittelfruh (6.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min0.46 oz Perle (7.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min1.11 oz Spalt Spalter (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 20 min

[Kellermeister]

My target is 1.052, my efficiency is a bit lower than 80%

[Kellermeister]

I just brewed my 4rth batch of alt in 4 weeks, so in the coming months I will be able to taste test and may make some adjustments. I have already found out that my old Ruhrpott Alt recipe, which was put together while using Caramunich I and Carafa I, does not work as well with Caramunich III and Carafa III. I do like to see a little light through the beer, the Ruhrpott Alt I am currently drinking is like a black hole of darkness.

[toonces]

what yeast are you using?

[Kellermeister]

Wyeast 1007

[Kellermeister]

Thats funny, I thought I posted a recipe in this thread but I don't see it anymore.

[Kellermeister]

OK an initial taste test tells me this recipe is not zum Uerige. It is not malty enough, the color is too light and there is too much hop flavor. The recipe was96% pilsner3% caramunich III1% carafa IIIhallertauer 60 min, 30 IBUsspalt 20 min, 7 IBUs1.042 So I do not recommend this recipe. I have a batch in the fermenter that has base malts 75% munich - 24% pilsner with the same caramunich/carafa percentages. When I keg that, it should tell if the munich base malt is superior to all pilsner. I also have a keg of my Ruhrpott Alt recipe, which turned out too dark, but otherwise was excellent. It came out dark because I formulated it using caramunich I and carafa I, and am now using III. Also my roast barley may be a darker type, it is rated at 500L, the same as carafa. Ruhrpott Alt is:60% munich30% pilsner4% caramunich3% melanoidin2% roast barley1% carafa30IBU Spalt 60 minutes This tasted very good but was too dark. You should be able to see through an alt. This week I will be using up the rest of a few bags of base malt so not necessarily following this recipe pattern. But I will try a specialty malt ratio of:5% caramunich III1% roast barley1% carafa III30 IBUs of Spalt for 60 minutes.1.052I want to brew one without melanoidin. The following week I may try:5% caramunich III3% melanoidin1% roast barley1% carafa III30 IBUs of Mr Hood for 60 minutes.1.052My spreadsheet says about SRM 34 which should be a nice dark amber.

[Brauer]

It doesn't surprise me that your version of the Zum Uerige didn't work out. 1.042 is too low an OG, and it's going to make the beer lack maltiness and be too pale and too hoppy.Also, the pilsner malt you chpose is crucial to getting the malt flavor you need. I've had good luck with Best Malz and Weyermann, but I wouldn't use an American malt for this, it will be too bland. You can use about 10-20% (German) Munich malt, but it quickly starts to be a different beer than ZU.One thing about color and beers like this that get their color from very small amounts of grain is that the final color depends a lot on process. You will probably need to fine tune the color malts to your brewery, for example, if you have a poor crush or lose a lot of wort to the tun.A lot of people forget how hoppy and pale ZU is, too. I was really surprised how much hop flavor it had, the first time I tried it and lucked pit to get a very fresh bottle, but I've also had a few older bottles that had very little. It doesn't take much age for those 20' hop flavors to fade.

[Kellermeister]

Tasting this brew 5 weeks after brewdate.color too light, increase SRM.not bitter enough, add carafanot enough body, push to 1.055foam is goodclarity is goodtoo much hop flavor, don't use flavor or aroma hops, use only bittering (60 min)Targets for next recipe:OG 1.055SRM 20IBU 3094% pilsner4% caramunich III2% carafa IIISpalt, 60 minute boil, to make 30 IBUmash 148F

[denny]

How is carafa gonna increase the bitterness? You need to get the IBUs up around 45-50.

[Kellermeister]

I'm talking about a coffee like bitterness from the malt.

[denny]

That's really weird...I've never gotten that from carafa. In fact, I've stopped using it in a couple recipes because I thought it was just too flavorless and I wanted more bite.

[djinkc]

How is carafa gonna increase the bitterness? You need to get the IBUs up around 45-50.

I think you'll be happier with that approach.

[Kellermeister]

Hops generally play second fiddle to malt in an altbier. If one were to put that many IBUs into an "alt", I think it would be more appropriate to call it a brown ale, not an alt. It would probably taste good, though.

[positiveContact]

Hops generally play second fiddle to malt in an altbier. If one were to put that many IBUs into an "alt", I think it would be more appropriate to call it a brown ale, not an alt. It would probably taste good, though.

I don't find IBUs particularly hoppy - just bitter.

[denny]

Hops generally play second fiddle to malt in an altbier. If one were to put that many IBUs into an "alt", I think it would be more appropriate to call it a brown ale, not an alt. It would probably taste good, though.

Not in a Dusseldorf alt like ZU. From the BJCP guidelines..."A bitter beer balanced by a pronounced malt richness". IBUs: 35 – 50

Edited by denny, 17 October 2011 - 09:37 AM.

[cavman]

Not in a Dusseldorf alt like ZU. From the BJCP guidelines..."A bitter beer balanced by a pronounced malt richness". IBUs: 35 – 50

I would also add that a flavor hop addition should be in a Dussy IMO.

[denny]

I would also add that a flavor hop addition should be in a Dussy IMO.

Agreed.