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questions about wine kit pyments


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#1 EWW

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 09:08 AM

I know a few people around here have done this. I have a 6 gallon RJ Spagnols Pinot Noir kit and want to turn it into 10-11 gallons of pyment. I've already determined that the juice and 18 lbs of honey will give me around 27 brix (1.1ish) and that should ferment to dry giving me around 13.5%.Assumption:-SNA as usualQuestions:-the kit comes with 30g of bentonite...add it, add twice as much, or toss it? It doesn't seem to be needed, but it won't do any harm so I'm thinking I'll probably just toss the 30g in-yeast? 71b or k1v or ???. The kit comes with K1v, but it's going to finish dry no matter what I use and I think the 71b will work well with the Pinot grapes.-oak or no oak? I'll probably wait till transfer to make this decision, but there's no way I'm using the bag of saw dust they included.-would this benefit from some extra tannins? A few cups of raisins would add mouthfeel and body and the tannin could balance out the honey a bit, but it's probably not really needed since I can get tannins from oak later on.-Sur Lie or not?
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#2 MtnBrewer

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 09:20 AM

If you use 71B, then I would not age sur lie. I wouldn't use the bentonite until you transfer to secondary. It's liable to knock the yeast out of suspension. Yeah, don't use the sawdust. Add oak cubes later if you want. You can also add tannin later if you think it needs the structure but Pinot Noir is usually fairly soft for a red so I don't think it will need it.

#3 EWW

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 09:56 AM

thanks.Why do people always say not to sur lie on 71b? Is it due to the M-L fermentation or something else?
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#4 MtnBrewer

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 12:13 PM

71B doesn't produce the glycerol that contributes to mouthfeel that other yeasts do and the autolysis flavors it creates are just nasty. That yeast has had genetic pressure put on it to ferment in a short amount of time for wines such as Beaujolais. If you want a good sur lie yeast, CY3079 is nice. I'm not sure how it would be with a red wine pyment since it's primarily for Burgundy-styled chardonnays but it does produce those buttery flavors and fat mouthfeel you associate with sur lie aging. I used it in an oak-aged show mead and was happy with the results.

#5 EWW

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 01:13 PM

Thanks again.
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#6 MtnBrewer

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 01:54 PM

De nada.One other thing. This is just me but when I do pyments I tend to use a yeast that was intended for whatever grape varietal I'm using. So for example, W15 or 58W3 for Riesling or Gewurtztraminer, RA17 or RC212 for Pinot Noir, etc.

#7 EWW

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 02:18 PM

De nada.One other thing. This is just me but when I do pyments I tend to use a yeast that was intended for whatever grape varietal I'm using. So for example, W15 or 58W3 for Riesling or Gewurtztraminer, RA17 or RC212 for Pinot Noir, etc.

That does seem to be ideal, but my local shop doesn't stock RA17 or RC212. I plan to pick up yeast today and I'll get this started tonight. I may just end up using either EC-1118 or K1V-1116. I'll be using TJ's mesquite honey since I have it and it's worked really well for me in the past.
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#8 EWW

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 06:51 PM

Picked up some EC-1118 and mixed this up in 2 6 gallon carboys. I did my best to use equal parts in each carboy. OG came out to around 26.75 brix / 1.103. The must has a great blackberry-ish flavor to it that I hope carries through to the end product. I'll give it a month primary and then transfer it all into a larger fermenter once it's free. You really have to love how simple meads are to make with a mix-stir...now if we could just figure out how to speed up the most mix waiting game. If anyone is coming out to NHC next year you may get to try some of these...hopefully that makes up for all the recent questions.
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#9 EWW

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 05:55 PM

This fermented out to dry quick. After 4 days it was down at 1.000ish. The flavors have held up well considering the hot etoh. I'm beginning to think this one didn't need the nutrients. I'll give it some more time to settle before I transfer it off the yeast.
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#10 EWW

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Posted 14 May 2012 - 08:40 PM

Carb or still or both? I have 10 gallons of this in kegs now. Taste wise this is rather nice.
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#11 MtnBrewer

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:31 AM

Carb or still or both? I have 10 gallons of this in kegs now. Taste wise this is rather nice.

I'd leave it still but it's your mead.

#12 armagh

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:37 AM

Carb or still or both? I have 10 gallons of this in kegs now. Taste wise this is rather nice.

I've never had a good sparkling pyment based on red wine juice, including ones I've made. Something inherently contradictory (IMO) about carbonated red, but that's just me.
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#13 Genesee Ted

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:57 AM

I would personally keep it still. If you want to see how it would be though, Carbonator Caps are your friend!

#14 miccullen

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 08:49 AM

do half each waythough I am not particularly a fan of sparkling reds
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#15 EWW

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 05:14 PM

Thanks for confirming my thoughts...will keep most this still
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#16 EWW

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 07:19 PM

Drinking an excess bottle that wouldn't fit in the kegs tonight. Lots of fruit character comes through...dark berry, cherry, etc. Nice tannins and well balance for being so young. The best taste description I can think of is a semisweet young red table wine - almost like communion wine, but tasty. If this continues to age well I'll be making many more of these.
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