26 replies to this topic

[Steve Urquell]

I bought 4 ozs. of these to try out with the intentions of a beer similar to Hop Stoopid. The descriptors of "tangerine" lured me in. I've read a few threads about these having either great flavor, or being totally nasty. I didn't know what to think of that, but I read a thread a few days ago about the nastyness being linked to a recessive gene that allows certain people to taste things that others don't. So, to avoid possible disaster, I steeped a few pellets in hot water the other night and holy hell!-- smelled like a dumpster behind a chinese resturant in the middle of summer. I strained the tea and put it in the fridge overnight and can also say that it tastes just as bad as it smells.Anyone have any experience with these hops--bad or good?

[Rick]

Oskar Blue's Gubna is made with all Summit. I get a lot of resinous dank with a hint of tangerine citrus. Nothing that I would describe as offensive.

[Steve Urquell]

That's also a beer that some people get an onion flavour/aroma out of. I can pick it up slightly if I try to look for it, but otherwise I get more of the citrusy notes.

Thanks for pointing me to a beer with those hops in it. Ratings of that beer follow suit with the recessive gene theory. In a science class, I picked up flavors from test strips that many others did not, so I'm guessing that I'm in the minority of folks who sense the nastyness of this hop. Bummer

[denny]

First, boiling them in water isn't a good way to get the character, IMO. I sometimes find Summit to have that onion quality early on, but it ages out shortly into a wonderful tangerine quality. One of my favorite hops.

[djinkc]

I get an onion/garlic smell when handling them. It doesn't seem to make it to the glass though.

[Steve Urquell]

First, boiling them in water isn't a good way to get the character, IMO. I sometimes find Summit to have that onion quality early on, but it ages out shortly into a wonderful tangerine quality. One of my favorite hops.

Was thinking of doing a single hop IPA with these. How heavily have have you used them in a recipe and is a single-hop recipe pushing it?

I get an onion/garlic smell when handling them. It doesn't seem to make it to the glass though.

Looks like maybe a small-batch experiment may be forthcoming.

[passlaku]

If you only used them for the 60 minute addition, the "flavor" aspect of the hop may not make it to the final beer. Then again, if it is anything like Chinook (a hop which I find not very palatable), it will linger for a long, long time - even if it is only used at the 60 minute addition.

[passlaku]

If you only used them for the 60 minute addition, the "flavor" aspect of the hop may not make it to the final beer. I remember using Summit as a bittering additions and they didn't seem gross or overly pronounced. If you have a very refined sense of taste then you may be able to pick it out. I found it nothing like Chinook, a hop which I do not find very palatable. Chinook is a hop that will cut into your taste buds and linger for a long, long time - even if it is only used at the 60 minute addition. When I used Summit as a bittering addition I found it to be a pretty neutral, nothing like Chinook at all. I probably wouldn't do a single hop pale ale with it, though.I apologize in advance to Chinook-lovers.

[Steve Urquell]

If you only used them for the 60 minute addition, the "flavor" aspect of the hop may not make it to the final beer. I remember using Summit as a bittering additions and they didn't seem gross or overly pronounced. If you have a very refined sense of taste then you may be able to pick it out. I found it nothing like Chinook, a hop which I do not find very palatable. Chinook is a hop that will cut into your taste buds and linger for a long, long time - even if it is only used at the 60 minute addition. When I used Summit as a bittering addition I found it to be a pretty neutral, nothing like Chinook at all. I probably wouldn't do a single hop pale ale with it, though.I apologize in advance to Chinook-lovers.

No apology necessary (I have a heavily chinooked IPA in primary right now and dig it;))I will definitely try them, maybe with restraint on the late additions till get a baseline for their contribution.

[djinkc]

OK, had a chance to check my notes. These were brewed in '08. My tasting notes weren't that great that year. If I was not happy or estatic it was noted.------ Am AmberHopburst with Chinook/Summit 20 min, 10 minSummit/Amarillo 5 minAmarillo 0 minNice beer-------House RyePA with a twistSummit/Cent/Cascade 60 minCascade 40 and 20 minCascade/Cent 0 minNice again-----Am RedSummit/Cents FWHCascade 0 minagain enjoyable-----Am Amber WheatMust have been thinking of Molbasser Summit 60 minSimcoe 45 minSimcoe 30 minSimcoe 15 minSimcoe 0 minagain really nice.-----I think it plays well with other C-hops. Not sure I would do/enjoy a 100% Summit brew. May have had Oscar's but that was probably at GABF - nuff said there. Unfortunately, I didn't write down AA's on all of these but be assured at my place they were way hoppy. No hint of onion/garlic in the glass. Just the nice citrusy C-hop you would expect. Maybe a little dark side too as noted before. etaThis is one of those hops that rile people up. Some hate it, just like I hate Fuggles. The only brew I liked them in was Quiet Storm. So take this for what it's worth

Edited by djinkc, 20 December 2010 - 06:20 PM.

[BlKtRe]

I cant believe somebody would intentionally make Gubna and think its good. Maybe a LOT less Summit and maybe blend it. Yack.

[Steve Urquell]

Hmm... You guys have got me thinking something like this for a 1.064 IPA:24 IBUs of columbus at 30 (for the resiny mouthfeel)remaining 40 IBUs from 15 and 0 minute additions with a blend of summit, amarillo, cascadedryhop with same blendHow does that sound?

[denny]

Was thinking of doing a single hop IPA with these. How heavily have have you used them in a recipe and is a single-hop recipe pushing it?

There was a recipe called "Griffin Spit" for Big Brew a few years back that's all Summit. It was my introduction to the hops and is still one of my favorite recipes. I brew it frequently. The recipe is in the AHA recipe wiki (a great resource you should all be aware of) at https://wiki.america...SpitIPAAllGrain .

[Steve Urquell]

There was a recipe called "Griffin Spit" for Big Brew a few years back that's all Summit. It was my introduction to the hops and is still one of my favorite recipes. I brew it frequently. The recipe is in the AHA recipe wiki (a great resource you should all be aware of) at https://wiki.america...SpitIPAAllGrain .

Really diggin' that malty grainbill. Great resourse too. I hadn't seen it. Thanks.

[denny]

Really diggin' that malty grainbill. Great resourse too. I hadn't seen it. Thanks.

We're trying to grow it...feel free to contribute!

[shmgeggie]

Just for the record, I love Oskar Blues' beer, for the most part. Ten Fiddy is a favortie of mine and my "house" pale is my take on Dale's. But Gubna is absolutely unpalatable to me. Onions!My homegrown Centennial had a touch of onion when they were green this year. Never noticed it before. I even picked up a hint after I dry-hopped in the keg but that's faded to where I can't taste it any more (thankfully).

[drewseslu]

So Summit...my old collaborator. Like CTZ, this hop is a tricky bastard, and in this case it really pays to know your source. Simcoe and Amarillo don't suffer from the same problem, as their source(s) are "controlled". Both Summit and CTZ (Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus) are grown for alpha and not for aroma, in general, so it really depends on the grower and the crop year for the quality of the hops, in addition to how they are used. A tea can be a good tool, but it will not illustrate how the hop will behave in a beer. The chemistry of a wort boil or beer dry hopping is much more complex than with water (poor quality or good quality).

[Steve Urquell]

So Summit...my old collaborator. Like CTZ, this hop is a tricky bastard, and in this case it really pays to know your source. Simcoe and Amarillo don't suffer from the same problem, as their source(s) are "controlled". Both Summit and CTZ (Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus) are grown for alpha and not for aroma, in general, so it really depends on the grower and the crop year for the quality of the hops, in addition to how they are used. A tea can be a good tool, but it will not illustrate how the hop will behave in a beer. The chemistry of a wort boil or beer dry hopping is much more complex than with water (poor quality or good quality).

Good info. A quick web search with the terms "summit hops, garlic, onion" reveals that this hop is, indeed, a tricky and unpredictable bastard.I have some DME on hand for my starters, so I will do a 1 gal batch and see what happens. Not going to waste a 6hr. brewday on it and possibly end up with 7gals. of breadstick dipping sauce.1.061/ 61 IBU1 lb. 2oz. DME3oz. C-602oz. cane sugar.19oz mag @ 30min..25oz. summit @ 15.25 summit @ 0.25 summit dry hopnotty

[stellarbrew]

My only real experience with Summit hops is Gubna. The first time I tried it, I thought it was some of the best beer I ever tried. A very pleasant orange-tangerine hoppiness; intense and satisfying for a hop head. Then next time I tried it, it tasted like concentrated onion juice. I'm not sure if my plate shifted in a just a week or two, or if there is variation in Gubna, based on batch or age. I've stayed away from using Summit hops since then because of the uncertainty.

[Steve Urquell]

I brewed the test batch as posted, let it drop clear and then dry-hopped with .20 oz. of summit. Before the dry-hop, the beer tasted OK. 3 days into the dry-hop and it tastes almost exactly like my nasty hop-tea did.Someone on another forum said that he knows someone who works for Hopsteiner. He said that the hops which taste nasty are ones which have been heavily fertilized and that if you want good ones, then buy organic. I guess I'll see how this one ages in the bottle. Hopefully the nasty will dissipate.