19 replies to this topic

[DubbelEntendre]

I Love IPAs. Between Victory Hop Devil and the DFH 60 Minute, this is the style that got me into craft brewing. As the weather warms in mid spring, I put away my Robust Porters, Imperial Stouts and Barley Wines for something lighter and more refreshing. My first go to style is always the IPA. This year, more so than in past years, I have really noticed that the offerings I have enjoyed are packed with tons of aroma and flavor. Most notably on this list are:Bell's HopslamGreen Flash IPAGreat Lakes Lake Erie MonsterWeyerbacher Hop StupidGreen Flash Imperial IPAGreen Flash IPA and Great Lakes Lake Erie Monster taste and smell like you are eating grapefruit and not drinking beer. Hopslam and Hop Stupid are more well rounded in their hop profile with light citrus notes on the nose and bitter, spicey, citrus flavor components. The Green Flash Imperial IPA seems to be comparable to the DFH 90 in malt hop balance, but the citrus really shines through in this beer as well.Now, my confession: I have never made what I consider to be a truly great IPA. When I get to appropriate hopping levels I find the beers to come out more grassy than boldly hopped.So, my question, Brews-Bros denizens, is: how do you achieve bold hop flavors and aromas in your beer?

[stellarbrew]

I too am still in pursuit of that truly great, ultra-hoppy IPA. In my pursuit, I have found that the best way to get an abundance of hop flavor, without all the grassy flavor, is to use high-alpha hops to minimize to amount of vegetal matter I'm putting into the beer for a given amount bitterness/flavor/aroma. Another good way to cut down on the grassiness in a hoppy IPA is to keep your dry-hop time to less than two weeks. If two weeks of dry-hopping isn't giving you enough aroma to suit your taste, then use more hops during that duration. Especially, use the high-alpha hops for the most bang for the buck , and the highest alpha-to-vegetal mass ratio.

[Slainte]

I've found "hop bursting" is the best way. As in, gain all of your bitterness from additions 20 minutes or less in the boil.I kegged a pale ale a few days ago that I used this technique on. Worked very well; the hop flavor and aroma is fantastic.Jamil wrote an article on this topic: https://www.mrmalty....ate_hopping.htm

[ncbeerbrewer]

I think ever since I brewed CJ's JPA I have really got into the idea of lat hopping in my IPA's and Pale Ales as well. I did the following hop schedule for an Imperial IPA and have gotten rave reviews with it too. I was pleased but those 20 minute and later additions are critical. Hey if you got it on your first try then you might not brew the same recipe up as often. 0.75 oz Cascade [8.00 %] (90 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 15.4 IBU 0.50 oz Summit [18.10 %] (90 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 25.8 IBU 1.00 oz Millenium [15.00 %] (60 min) Hops 36.4 IBU 1.00 oz Summit [18.10 %] (30 min) Hops 33.8 IBU 2.00 oz Centennial [8.00 %] (10 min) Hops 14.1 IBU 1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.00 %] (5 min) Hops 3.9 IBU 1.00 oz Centennial [8.00 %] (5 min) Hops 3.9 IBU 1.00 oz Cascade [8.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops - 1.00 oz Cascade [8.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -

[NomNomHopzinator]

That is a great article Slainte, thanks for posting it.

[drewseslu]

For my APA I hop it at a rate of 3lbs/bbl with 1lb/bbl at flameout and 1lb/bbl in the dry hop...at 4.5% ABV and 45 IBUs it is a session hop bomb...and at higher hopping rate than anything Stone makes (with the exception of their Black Pilsner one time only brew), it is truly a BOMB.

[earthtone]

I made an IPA with only a FWH and a dry hop and though I don't think these can exclusively get to that huge hop bomb level, the FWH has taught me that it is a necessary addition to boost the perceived bitterness and flavour of the late addition hops as well as the bittering hops.I think if you want truly "Bold Hop Flavour..." you need a FWH addition just as a bold aroma almost certainly utilizes a dry hop.Currently I am working on an IPA that is FWH with 1/3 the total hops and then hop bursted for the last 20 min. and dry hopped to see what kind of horizon is out there to hit..... share your secrets to big bold hoppiness, enough of us are making em I'm sure there's some good house bitter bitter brews in some of your kegerators!

[chefmiller]

I love the JPA recipe, but I'm waiting until I win the lottery to throw 9.25 oz. of hops into one five gallon batch again! Is there a less expensive way?

[3rd party JKor]

I love the JPA recipe, but I'm waiting until I win the lottery to throw 9.25 oz. of hops into one five gallon batch again! Is there a less expensive way?

Buy your hops in bulk?

[NomNomHopzinator]

I am curious about this too. That late addition article was great but I wonder if there are any other techniques out there. I have read about full boils vs partials and that in partial boils, the higher conc. of sugars decreases the solubility of the oils from the hops and ends up capping your IBUs. With brews such as Stones Ruination IPA that come in over 100 IBU....how exactly do they do that? Do they just add copious amounts of high AA hops? Do they add more iso-AAs after the beer ferments and drops from the OG? I noticed that the beer has a fairly light body. For a high IBU beer, should you keep the OG fairly low? If anyone can share their wisdom or link to some more articles like the one above that would be excellent!

[BrewerGeorge]

I am curious about this too. That late addition article was great but I wonder if there are any other techniques out there. I have read about full boils vs partials and that in partial boils, the higher conc. of sugars decreases the solubility of the oils from the hops and ends up capping your IBUs. With brews such as Stones Ruination IPA that come in over 100 IBU....how exactly do they do that? Do they just add copious amounts of high AA hops? Do they add more iso-AAs after the beer ferments and drops from the OG? I noticed that the beer has a fairly light body. For a high IBU beer, should you keep the OG fairly low? If anyone can share their wisdom or link to some more articles like the one above that would be excellent!

Sort of right. High concentration of sugar in partial boils decreases hop utilization so you have to use more hops to achieve the same level of bitterness. That's not a huge problem though. The bigger problem with hops and concentrated boil is that IBU's are a unit of concentration of isomerized alpha acid. The the chemical solubility limit of that is somewhere around 100 IBU's. (Beers that list themselves as dramatically above 100 are fibbing. The calculators go that high, but in real beer it tops out at approx 100.) Unfortunately for people trying to make the hop bombs with partial boil, the IBU's get diluted when the makeup water is added - just like the gravity does. For example, if you max out the hops in a 3 gallon boil, you'll have roughly 300 "IBU-points" to work with. Dilute that in the fermenter to 5 gallons and you end up with a finished beer around 60 IBU's. There's no way around this, AFAIK, except doing full boils. I don't think the major brewing programs take this effect into account, either.Regarding your original question, it seems to me like you're more interested in flavor and aroma than in pure bitterness. As several others have said, hopbursting is a great way to get huge flavor and aroma. I totally understand the point about 9oz of hops, though. I use sort of a hybrid method with a high alpha @60 for about half of the bitterness and the remainder of the bitterness from hopbursting. Works pretty well, but isn't as extravagant with the hops.

[3rd party JKor]

Unfortunately for people trying to make the hop bombs with partial boil, the IBU's get diluted when the makeup water is added - just like the gravity does. For example, if you max out the hops in a 3 gallon boil, you'll have roughly 300 "IBU-points" to work with. Dilute that in the fermenter to 5 gallons and you end up with a finished beer around 60 IBU's. There's no way around this, AFAIK, except doing full boils. I don't think the major brewing programs take this effect into account, either.

You could boil the equivalent of 100IBUs of hops in your dilution water, although in reality that's just a roundabout way of doing a full boil. Albeit not requiring the larger pot.

[NomNomHopzinator]

Yeah that is a good point and probably the limiting factor, not so much the gravity. The IAA have a certain weight/volume solubility and if you are going for the max concentration of IAA in your final volume, you have to use that total volume in the boil...you can't double up the weight/volume in a partial boil and hope to dilute it out to 100 IBU like you are saying since it is impossible. Wait, your example throws me. You should never be able to achieve more than 100 IBU per volume since it is roughly the max IAA solubility. If you do a 3 gallon boil for a 5 gallon batch, you can achieve ~100IBU in that pot but when you dilute it out to 5 gallons you are ending up with ~60 IBU (100*3/5). Is that what you mean? Curious how the gravity caps the IBU still. It would be neat to see numbers on maximum IBU vs FG. Yeah I don't mean to stray from the subject. IBU limitations are good to understand when dealing with bold hop flavor but the late addition sounds quite important for hop aroma and bitterness. I have usually been using my high AA hops early in the boil and doing low AA, highly aromatic hops for the last 10 minutes, but the next time around I want to save some of the high AAs for the end. I like NCs recipe to add Amarillo and Centennial at the 5min mark.

[Slainte]

You could boil the equivalent of 100IBUs of hops in your dilution water

You'll certainly get more extraction by boiling in water, due to the lower gravity and higher pH. I would expect to get a coarser and harsher bitterness doing it that way.

[DubbelEntendre]

Yeah I don't mean to stray from the subject. IBU limitations are good to understand when dealing with bold hop flavor but the late addition sounds quite important for hop aroma and bitterness.

Just as a correction to this, if I am understanding things correctly; the late addition is important to the aroma and the flavor. While you will gain some bitterness out of the late hop additions, the fact that the hops have less contact time with the boiling wort means a lower rate of isomerization of the alpha acids, which will produce less bitterness. The bold flavor and aroma that you are really trying to capture are what come from the large burst late hop additions.

[chefmiller]

Buy your hops in bulk?

I do, but I'm not a rich man. Even in bulk, 9.25 oz. per 5 gallon batch is going to run me out of hops pretty quickly!

[ncbeerbrewer]

Dubbel you are correct in your assessment.

[Deerslyr]

I do, but I'm not a rich man. Even in bulk, 9.25 oz. per 5 gallon batch is going to run me out of hops pretty quickly!

Why not treat yourself just once. It's probably going to cost about $20 to $30 in hops, and then you can say you've done it. If you really like it, then you can save up for it. Nuttin says you have to do it all the time, right? My buddy and I bought a pound of Saaz on E-Bay and made 10 gallons of Pilsner Urquell during a time that we weren't sure if he was going to have a job anymore due to impending layoffs. We just said "what the hell, why not?" and did it.When my hops comes in, I may try something ridiculously high in IBU's, but that's because I expect to be coming out of my ears with Mt. Hood (in addition to the pound I have in pellet form in the fridge).

[hullabrew]

I've found "hop bursting" is the best way. As in, gain all of your bitterness from additions 20 minutes or less in the boil.I kegged a pale ale a few days ago that I used this technique on. Worked very well; the hop flavor and aroma is fantastic.Jamil wrote an article on this topic: https://www.mrmalty....ate_hopping.htm

I just brewed Denny's Rye and used hop bursting. I'm completely sold. I don't think that I'll make another IPA without using this technique. The Jamil article is a great reference. Somewhere in there it recommends if bittering above 50 IBU to us a small addition of hops early in the boil. I hopped to about 75 IBU and used 30 IBU worth of Summit hops at 60 min. This was definitely a good idea. The other 45 IBU's were at 20 min and later. The result is the right amount of bitterness, but completely smooth. The aroma is fantastic, and I didn't even dry hop it. I used whole hops for this, but I would highly recommend using pellets. My whole hops measured out to 17.25 oz. That's a lot of hop matter to deal with.TRY IT!!!!

[CarlosM]

I do staggered additions of hops to achieve hop taste and I use a bit calcium to bring that bitter bite to it. sry hop in the keg with an ounceand ta da!HOP JUICE!