14 replies to this topic

[djinkc]

I've had a couple conversations in the last few years about inadequate attenuation. A couple people came to the conclusion it was from putting the IC in the kettle for the whole boil. Since I had been doing that I started putting it in with about 20 minutes to go. Since I've been using pellet hops almost exclusively lately and it's a PIA to hold the hop bag, which may already have 6 - 8 oz of hops at that point, over the kettle while I put the IC in. That's begging for a burn accident.So, I'm modifying my hop bag holder tonight and really don't want to rig something to lift and hold the hop bag while the IC gets put in. Does anyone think there is any credence to this idea? I know copper was used for kettles in the past. I usually don't bother with FG readings since I keg, did think I had a slight attenuation problem that has gone away since I mash lower now. Any thoughts?

[drewseslu]

Talk to Konertjm, he narrowed an attenuation problem a few years back down to this very issue.

[Big Nake]

I guess I wonder why the IC in the kettle would cause a problem with attenuation. I put my copper IC in a bucket of starsan for a few minutes and then put it into the brewpot after flameout to start the chill.

[drewseslu]

There is a copper ion being dissolved into the wort (plus 2 or 3), that is either toxic to yeast, on its own or reacts to form such a compound, once it reaches certain levels.

[djinkc]

I forgot to ask Jim when we visited at Heritage Fest. Wonder why I did find an archive that claimed acid rinses rather than alkaline will limit Cu pickup but of course no mention of the ions....... As if I would remember my chemistry that well anyway. So Starsan should help. My IC has a pretty big diameter, no containers around that I really want to fill with StarSan that would hold it. Probably would take 12 gallons to submerge it. Plus the moving the hop bag issue........I think I'll just try leaving it in for the whole boil tomorrow, take good notes and a FG reading. And another excuse to not clean the fugly patina off the IC for another week.

[MyaCullen]

I forgot to ask Jim when we visited at Heritage Fest. Wonder why I did find an archive that claimed acid rinses rather than alkaline will limit Cu pickup but of course no mention of the ions....... As if I would remember my chemistry that well anyway. So Starsan should help. My IC has a pretty big diameter, no containers around that I really want to fill with StarSan that would hold it. Probably would take 12 gallons to submerge it. Plus the moving the hop bag issue........I think I'll just try leaving it in for the whole boil tomorrow, take good notes and a FG reading. And another excuse to not clean the fugly patina off the IC for another week.

could you just soak a sponge in star san heavily, and wipe it down a couple times?

[djinkc]

could you just soak a sponge in star san heavily, and wipe it down a couple times?

Probably, it has a splice or two in it that I would rather heat sanitize. I get pretty picky on sanitation post flameout/power off. Probably too much........

[MyaCullen]

Probably, it has a splice or two in it that I would rather heat sanitize. I get pretty picky on sanitation post flameout/power off. Probably too much........

gotchaFWIW I have always dropped mine in at 15-20 min remaining, and i don't use a hop sack so i am really no help

[drewseslu]

Also a healthy dose of yeast nutrient should give 'em a leg up (with plenty of Zn +2).

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I've been tossing mine in at 20 mins and haven't noticed any attenuation issues with typical gravity beers.

[3rd party JKor]

I boil mine the whole time. I haven't had anything that I would consider an attenuation problems. What kind of problem are you having? Are we talking 1 or 2 points off expected attenuation or 4-5?

[djinkc]

I boil mine the whole time. I haven't had anything that I would consider an attenuation problems. What kind of problem are you having? Are we talking 1 or 2 points off expected attenuation or 4-5?

Just changing my routine......... again. As posted before I don't take FGs very often since I keg. Just relying on taste in the final product. Suppose I should get a bit more picky but low mash temps lately have been giving me what I want. And I did have it in the kettle for the entire sparge/boil yesterday. Honestly, I don't think it matters. Just trying to find out what others think.

[ncbeerbrewer]

I boil mine the whole time. I haven't had anything that I would consider an attenuation problems. What kind of problem are you having? Are we talking 1 or 2 points off expected attenuation or 4-5?

Following this discussion I just curious to ask but: Why leave your IC in your wort for the whole boil? My feeling and understanding is the IC should go in with 15-10 mins left purely just to sanitize it before chill down. Sorry not trying to pick but I don't see a point in having a copper coil in the boil for the whole time. I have never heard of or had any attenuation problems due to this suggested idea but just a question I have. Cheers!!

[3rd party JKor]

Following this discussion I just curious to ask but: Why leave your IC in your wort for the whole boil? My feeling and understanding is the IC should go in with 15-10 mins left purely just to sanitize it before chill down. Sorry not trying to pick but I don't see a point in having a copper coil in the boil for the whole time. I have never heard of or had any attenuation problems due to this suggested idea but just a question I have. Cheers!!

I use my boil kettle as my HERMS tank and my IC does double duty as the HERMS coil. During the mash the coil is in the kettle and it has wort running through it, when the mash is done I just leave it there because there's no compelling reason to take it out.