18 replies to this topic

[passlaku]

A batch I just kegged has mediciney off flavors. I am thinking that the water company has either jacked up the amount of chlorine in the water or has started adding chloramines for summer.

[Jimmy James]

So, what brew was it? Maybe lay a recipe on us or point us to a link? Anything more descriptive than medicine? Would you say phenolic (like band-aid) or rubbing alcohol, or something else? I don't know how chloramine would factor in, but I am sure with some details the board here can help identify probable sources.

[jammer]

I had a hef turn out tasting like band-aids a year or so ago. I dont really know what i did wrong, but I have never done it again, thank goodness.

[passlaku]

It was an American Brown that was inspired by Tasty's Janet's Brown, but with a lower gravity. I used Nottingham dry yeast and the flavor is very subtle. It is kind of like band-aid lite. I wonder if a colder temp and carbonation would downplay the band-aid flavor; again, it is very subtle. I suspect that I would have to tell my BMC-drinking friends to look for the flavor to find it. I am wondering if it might be just some of the iodophor that I used as sanitizer.

[lowendfrequency]

Does your water taste like chlorine? I ask, because acceptable levels of chlorine in drinking water should never be detectable by taste. Also, chlorine evaporates extremely fast. Even faster during a rigorous boil. I'd suspect your yeast handling before pointing the blame on the water. Classic phenolic off-flavors are described as medicine or band-aid.

[ChefLamont]

We also assume you are not using bleach anywhere in your process (been there, done that, have the t-shirt).Chlorophenols are nasty little boogers that most people can taste in the parts per Billion range. It takes little chlorinating compounds making it through the system to get them.Are you carbon filtering the water?

[siouxbrewer]

I'd guess your cold ferment caused it. I've had this happen with British strains. I ferment in my basement, sometimes in the low 60's, one batch using manchester was undrinkably phenolic.

[Stout_fan]

The phenols come from too high of a fermentation temp.Chloramines CANNOT be removed by a carbon block filter. You need to use a Campden tablet.

[siouxbrewer]

The phenols come from too high of a fermentation temp.

Are you sure? I've never had high levels of phenols from too high of fermentation temp. Fusels and esters yes, but never phenols. Same thing with pitching rate, lower rate, higher phenols.

[passlaku]

Nottingham is strange when it gets too warm. The last batch I dumped was a Nottingham stout that got too hot during ferment. I fermented probably in the low 60s in an Igloo cube with frozen water bottles. At the end of the ferment I dryhopped it pretty warm for about a week. I was out of town and it could have been this warm period where the yeast went wild. Again, it was about a week after the initial ferment. As for filtering, I have a culligan undersink filter.

[Stout_fan]

Are you sure? I've never had high levels of phenols from too high of fermentation temp. Fusels and esters yes, but never phenols. Same thing with pitching rate, lower rate, higher phenols.

Yes. IIRC I had some fusels as well, no esters though.ref

[BrewerGeorge]

...Chloramines CANNOT be removed by a carbon block filter. You need to use a Campden tablet.

Yes they can, as long as you filter slowly enough. With my undersink filter, "slow enough" is in the 1 gallon/minute range.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

some info:My link

* Filtration for chloramine is very expensive compared to filtration for chlorine. * To remove chloramine, an extensive carbon filter (to remove the chlorine part of the chloramine molecule) followed by a reverse osmosis or cation filter (to remove the ammonia) is necessary. * There is NO certified showerhead filter to remove chloramine. The high flow rate and large volume of water passing through a showerhead renders the showerhead filter useless. * Sink water filters for chloramine handle low flow, cold water conditions only. * For high flow uses like showering and bathing, a whole house filtration system would be needed to effectively remove chloramine and ammonia. * A whole house filtration system could cost between $10,000 to $15,000 with $1,200 maintenance per year. * For a 5-unit apartment building, the cost could be as high as $80,000 to $120,000 plus yearly maintenance. * Even with a comprehensive filtration system, no filtration system engineer will guarantee complete removal of chloramine. Chlorine is by far easier to remove with inexpensive carbon filtration.

[BrewerGeorge]

some info:My link

Let's just say I'm a bit dubious of information of a "Citizens Against Chlorine" website. In any case, all I can relate is my own personal experience. I'm certain that my town uses chloramine in the summer. Before I filter it, it tastes and smells like chlorine. After going through my $50 Culligan under sink (cold water, 1gpm or so) the smell and taste is gone. Never any medicinal qualities to the beer, either.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Let's just say I'm a bit dubious of information of a "Citizens Against Chlorine" website. In any case, all I can relate is my own personal experience. I'm certain that my town uses chloramine in the summer. Before I filter it, it tastes and smells like chlorine. After going through my $50 Culligan under sink (cold water, 1gpm or so) the smell and taste is gone. Never any medicinal qualities to the beer, either.

yeah - i figured the act of filtering it was less political/tin foil hat so hopefully that information was accurate

[chuck_d]

Increased pitching rates increase solventy flavors (ethyl acetate), while decreasing yeast growth and subsequently banana esters and fusel alcohols.Increased fermentation temps will increase production of solvent & fruity esters, as well as SO2, diacetyl & acetaldehyde.Edit: FWIW, medicinal flavors can also come from hops (just found that in my notes too :huh:I went with solventy in my reply because I feel like that can be mistaken for medicinal.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Let's just say I'm a bit dubious of information of a "Citizens Against Chlorine" website. In any case, all I can relate is my own personal experience. I'm certain that my town uses chloramine in the summer. Before I filter it, it tastes and smells like chlorine. After going through my $50 Culligan under sink (cold water, 1gpm or so) the smell and taste is gone. Never any medicinal qualities to the beer, either.

is this source better?My link

[Recklessdeck]

A batch I just kegged has mediciney off flavors. I am thinking that the water company has either jacked up the amount of chlorine in the water or has started adding chloramines for summer.

My brewing chem book says that unwanted phenolic compounds are almost always extracted during mashing and sparging due to improper temperature, PH and volume of sparge water. Could this have been an issue?

[Stout_fan]

Yes they can, as long as you filter slowly enough. With my undersink filter, "slow enough" is in the 1 gallon/minute range.

Well, that's good news. All the sources I've heard/read said it cannot be done. We're still with insane chlorine level here. Nice to know someone beat the system George!