31 replies to this topic

[OrionPax]

As with my post about efficiency, I am looking for some data for a course project in which I am designing a new brewing system. Please take a minute to respond the the questions below, and I'll update with my findings as the project moves along.1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? If so, why?2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? What kind?3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Please try to quantify.4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance?5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? Please comment on your preference.I'm considering using one or two pumps on the pre-boil side of my system. My initial impression is that they can be great labor savors, but I just don't trust their sanatizability enough to use one post-boil. I know people do, but I'm somewhat neurotic about this. Also, in the configurations I'm considering, it should be straight-forward to gravity feed from the boil kettle to the fermenter. I plan to use either an immersion chiller with my own mixing system design, or a gravity-fed counterflow chiller of some sort, so I won't have a need to pump the boiled wort.Thanks in advance for taking the time to respond.

[BrewerGeorge]

As with my post about efficiency, I am looking for some data for a course project in which I am designing a new brewing system. Please take a minute to respond the the questions below, and I'll update with my findings as the project moves along.1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? If so, why?2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? What kind?3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Please try to quantify.4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance?5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? Please comment on your preference.I'm considering using one or two pumps on the pre-boil side of my system. My initial impression is that they can be great labor savors, but I just don't trust their sanatizability enough to use one post-boil. I know people do, but I'm somewhat neurotic about this. Also, in the configurations I'm considering, it should be straight-forward to gravity feed from the boil kettle to the fermenter. I plan to use either an immersion chiller with my own mixing system design, or a gravity-fed counterflow chiller of some sort, so I won't have a need to pump the boiled wort.Thanks in advance for taking the time to respond.

1) Got one. I've always used it. I've found MORE uses for it as time goes on.2) Yes, one March 809.3) It's hard to quantify, but the pump saves me immense amounts of labor and effort. Five years ago when I started brewing, I would be absolutely beat after a brewday from lifting water around. Now I can brew two batches in one day and feel perfectly fine afterward, or brew after work before bed. However, I think I may spend MORE time because of the pump than I did with Denny-style brewing. A lot of that, though, can be attributed to improvements in process that were made possible because of the pump that nevertheless take more time. A quick example would be longer mash recirc using the pump to get clearer beer.4) I don't think it takes any additional work. I do have to sanitize it before using it post-boil, but that takes literally seconds. Cleanup after brewing is simply rinsing with leftover HLT water as I use it to spray down and clean the kettle. Maybe twice a year I will spend 30 minutes taking it apart and doing a more agressive clean to get rid of beer stone.5) I use QD's. IMO, most of the utility of pumps is made possible by QD's. At the very least, it improves the cost efficiency of pumps by letting you use one pump for 4 or 5 different purposes quickly.One pump or two is basically a decision of batch vs fly sparge. You can bactch sparge with just one pump, but you need two to fly (unless you use gravity to replace one of them.)BTW, it really IS safe to use pumps post boil - assuming you get a mag driven pump. They're no harder to sanitize than tubing. If anything they're easier because you can use more aggressive methods than with vinyl tubing.

[djinkc]

March 809. Pumps (underlets) initial mash infusion water, recirculates for the EHERMs, drains the Mashtun to the kettle. Makes parts of brewing very easy. QD's - same as George's. I only use it for preboil so sanitation is not a factor - I'm set up for gravity to finish the job. Cleaning is simply 4 - 5 gallons of hot water run through it with the semi-yearly hard cleaning.

[siouxbrewer]

I'd like to get Mcmaster carr part #'s for both the QD's and silicone tubing George uses. Maybe put it in the FAQ for future reference?

[BrewerGeorge]

I'd like to get Mcmaster carr part #'s for both the QD's and silicone tubing George uses. Maybe put it in the FAQ for future reference?

I would have sworn it was in the FAQ already. Here's the article that used to be on my site.

Several people asked about my QD's when I posted the brew cart pics. I finally got around to looking up what I bought. I bought brass. I just couldn't spend what poly ones would have cost. I got them from McMaster-Carr. They're called 'Brass Coolant Hose Couplings' and are found on page 241. I got 10 male connectors ( p/n 6739K59) and 6 female hose connectors ( p/n 6739K64) for less than $40.The tubing is 1/2" ID, 3/4" OD silicone (pg 98, p/n 3038K26). It's really pricey; 10ft was almost $30, but there's no real substitute. It's translucent so I can see flow.Male fittings are installed on all "things," with female fittings on both ends of hoses. Initially, I did it that way because male fittings are about a third the price of female. A nice accidental benefit is that I can make/break fittings with just one hand if the female is on the hose. The sleeve on the fitting slides toward the back to release and I can both hold the hose and slide it with the same hand. If I'd had female on the "things" with male hoses, I'd need two hands to make connections.Also, I've found that even though the fittings are full-flow, they won't leak much if you close the valves at both ends and only disconnect one side at a time. The closed valve acts like a finger on a straw and holds the liquid in. Update: 1/11/06The female QD's ship with grease inside that looks (and sticks) like silicone keg lube. It's brassy colored, but that's probably from machining dust. I soaked mine in peroxide and vinegar solution and used pipe cleaners to get all the grease out. Took a little time, but you only need to do it once. The QD's still work fine without the grease.

[siouxbrewer]

Thanks George!

[djinkc]

Thanks George!

Lee, those QDs are nice. Easy to use and don't leak. For a while I thought I would need gloves to switch them. Now it doesn't take long enough to even know they're hot.

[siouxbrewer]

Yeah I use the same ones and I love them, but I've lost the part numbers at some point along the way. Need to pick up a few more sets, my tinkering is never ending.

[Stout_fan]

1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? No2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? What kind? two march's3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Please try to quantify.My system is a three piece. Pumping is required4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance? I recirc HLT boiling water for 15 minutes prior to knock out. This sanitizes my hoses, CFWC and pump. So it's not really MORE work.5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? Please comment on your preference.Plastic Hi temps 1/2" QDC's from More Beer

[Deerslyr]

1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? No2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? What kind? two march's3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Please try to quantify.My system is a three piece. Pumping is required4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance? I recirc HLT boiling water for 15 minutes prior to knock out. This sanitizes my hoses, CFWC and pump. So it's not really MORE work.5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? Please comment on your preference.Plastic Hi temps 1/2" QDC's from More Beer

Pretty much what both Stout and George say... except I don't use QD's. I have threaded copper fittings with ball valves. Also, I use it for fly sparging with gravity to drain the tun. The pump is hooked up to float switch, so I can pretty much leave the tun while it is sparging.

[Stout_fan]

... The pump is hooked up to float switch, so I can pretty much leave the tun while it is sparging.

Now that I like!

[davelew]

1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? Yes. I have a March 809 pump that I never use. I tried using it to recirculate the wort in steel mash-tun on a burner, but found that a cooler mash tun with infusions worked better once I understood how much water was needed to change temperature on my system.2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? No, but I have a March 809 sitting in my basement.3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Monitoring the pump, the temp, and the burner was more work than it saved.4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance? Sanitizing is easy, just pump close to boiling water through it and then sanitizer solution.5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? I bought some PVDF quick-disconnects from Northern Brewer about five years ago. They were so sticky and hard to use that I abandoned them.

[HVB]

1. Have you used but later abandoned a pump in your brewing system? If so, why?started with one and moved to a second. Never see getting rid of them. 2. Do you currently use a pump or pumps in your brewing system? What kind?Use two. One is an Iwaki and one is a Little Giant. Had a March 809 but did not like it.3. How much time and effort does using a pump/pumps save you during the brewing process? Please try to quantify.Hard to quantify but seeing I re-circulate I could not do that without a pump and getting my wort from the HLT to the BK takes a couple of minutes now as opposed to dumping into a pain then dumping into the BK. It is also safer withteh pump. 4. How much additional work does a pump create, in terms of cleaning, sanitizing, and any required maintenance?None, saves time. I will heat some water with PBW and use the pumps to re-circulate through the system5. Do you use quick disconnect or fixed (threaded, soldered, etc) fittings? Please comment on your preference.Yes, the brass ones from Mcmaster. I used some large shrink tubing to help keep the ends cool I'm considering using one or two pumps on the pre-boil side of my system. My initial impression is that they can be great labor savors, but I just don't trust their sanatizability enough to use one post-boil. I know people do, but I'm somewhat neurotic about this. Also, in the configurations I'm considering, it should be straight-forward to gravity feed from the boil kettle to the fermenter. I plan to use either an immersion chiller with my own mixing system design, or a gravity-fed counterflow chiller of some sort, so I won't have a need to pump the boiled wort.Thanks in advance for taking the time to respond.

[Deerslyr]

Now that I like!

It's pretty slick. My buddy was building one for himself and most of the parts came in packs with multiple parts. So he manufactured one for me. All I had to do was buy the power cord and we split the cost of the parts.

[CaptRon]

I don't have a pump, but it is something I think I need to add to my brewery at some point. Especially after I get my hands on one more keggle. I'm getting tired of lifting hot water around all the time these days.

[SchwanzBrewer]

I use an aquarium pump to recirculate the cold water through the plate chiller, that is all. The chiller saves a ton of time: 1 hour to chill, down to 10 minutes for a 5 gallon batch.Cheers,Rich

[BrewerGeorge]

I use an aquarium pump to recirculate the cold water through the plate chiller, that is all. The chiller saves a ton of time: 1 hour to chill, down to 10 minutes for a 5 gallon batch.Cheers,Rich

In this same spirit, I suppose I should add that I also have a submersible pump that I occasionally use to recirc chill water through the IM. I use it for ales during the summer when ground water temps rise above 65F and all year round for lagers.

[SchwanzBrewer]

In this same spirit, I suppose I should add that I also have a submersible pump that I occasionally use to recirc chill water through the IM. I use it for ales during the summer when ground water temps rise above 65F and all year round for lagers.

I just buy 3 bags of ice and put the whole thing in the cooler.Cheers,Rich

[Deerslyr]

I use an aquarium pump to recirculate the cold water through the plate chiller, that is all. The chiller saves a ton of time: 1 hour to chill, down to 10 minutes for a 5 gallon batch.Cheers,Rich

In this same spirit, I suppose I should add that I also have a submersible pump that I occasionally use to recirc chill water through the IM. I use it for ales during the summer when ground water temps rise above 65F and all year round for lagers.

I just buy 3 bags of ice and put the whole thing in the cooler.Cheers,Rich

Ok, I have a sump pump to circulate water through the plate chiller, but I'm just having problems figuring out how to keep the water cold enough. I also have a chillzilla that I can immerse in ice, but I just can't seem to get the temps down. How are you setting up the configuration of the chilling water to recirculate cold water and save??? I figure I use around 20 gallons just to get it to a crappy non-pitching temp... At least I have the chest freezer now and can get the temps down quicker.

[BrewerGeorge]

Ok, I have a sump pump to circulate water through the plate chiller, but I'm just having problems figuring out how to keep the water cold enough. I also have a chillzilla that I can immerse in ice, but I just can't seem to get the temps down. How are you setting up the configuration of the chilling water to recirculate cold water and save??? I figure I use around 20 gallons just to get it to a crappy non-pitching temp... At least I have the chest freezer now and can get the temps down quicker.

I run tap water first without recircing to get down as low as that will go. Then switch chill water source to the pump and ice water which I DO recirculate.ETA: There are two issues here which are having enough energy sink capacity (enough ice) and also having a difference in temperature to drive the energy transfer. I don't time to go into it deeply now, and it probably deserves another thread. Start one if you're interested and I'll respond later.