39 replies to this topic

[earthtone]

Damn so I brewed this last Wed and I haven't seen any activity. On saturday I was starting to get suspicious, LHBS closed sunday, woke up today still no bubbles, no krausen, no airlock activity, sediment layered on bottom. Going to check the gravity just to be double sure when I get home tonight..... But I called the LHBS and they don't have any lager yeasts at the moment... but they get a shipment of wyeast on wednesday or thursday............. shittty. Not sure what to do, given that there seems to be no evidence of poor sanitation - and my practice is pretty tight as far as apartment brewing goes.... I guess I'll have a better idea once I am sure no fermentation has taken place...I know I underpitched a bit, for my OG the Mr. Malty called for 150 billion cells, and the wyeast smack pack got me 2/3s of the way there. So any suggestions? make it an ale? wait it out if it's still seeming to be clean (thursday I can get another smackpack, then I need to make starter and pitch at high krausen so probably not till friday)??? How do I save this batch???It was brewed Wednesday last, so this is day 5. It's been sitting at 47 df the whole time. I tried warming it to 55df and shaking for a few hours the day after brewing but I didn't want it to sit at a warmer temp while I was away at school so it's been back in the cold since then.help. :DThought I would start a thread outside the recipe thread so it doesn't clutter things up. Also to get more of your opinions

[Big Nake]

See what happens? I told you to post a pic of you wearing those music-themed oven mitts. Now the Gods of yeast are mad at you. Seriously, I can't see how you could get no activity at all. It doesn't sound like you pitched under ideal circumstances, but you should still have activity.

[Slainte]

I know I underpitched a bit, for my OG the Mr. Malty called for 150 billion cells, and the wyeast smack pack got me 2/3s of the way there.

150 billion cells seems very low for a target pitching rate. Did you have the calculator set to "ale?" How many gallons did you make? 5 gallons of 1.050 lager for example needs around 350 billion cells...

[Big Nake]

150 billion cells seems very low for a target pitching rate. Did you have the calculator set to "ale?" How many gallons did you make? 5 gallons of 1.050 lager for example needs around 350 billion cells...

But don't you think that after 5 days you'd at least have positive pressure in the airlock? I remember (when I was a newbie), just pitching the contents of a White Labs vial into 5 gallons of lager wort. I can't remember how long it took for activity, but it couldn't have been more than 2 days. 5 days seems too long to me.

[Thirsty]

At 47 degrees though you would be at the brink of crashing if there was not a good start.

[BlKtRe]

Without a gravity reading you have no clue for sure. Also, lager sometimes can take at least 2 weeks to ferment. And at 47*, you may not see much krausen or airlock activity. Sometimes its just slow. Id say take a gravity reading before getting all freaky.

[boo boo]

Without a proper starter, using a smack pack that wasn't totally inflated, pitched into wort at 47*f and I guess not sufficiently aerated..... I would say this one will take a long time to start and would also venture that the attenuation will be lacking due to underpitching.You might get away with using ale pitching practices some of the time, but it's times like this that bite you in the ass.Had you let the pack totally inflate and build up a proper starter, I would doubt that you would be experiencing this problem now.A 2 month old smack pack is less than ideal, and consider how far it has traveled to get to us here in Canada in unknown conditions. I make a starter even for ale yeasts when using liquid yeast. I don't like long lag times.

[ncbeerbrewer]

I would have to agree with all the responses here so far ET. Yes it does sounds like you underpitched which in itself will slow the start of fermentaton. Secondly you are at 47 degrees and thats pretty cold too so it will cause start up to be slow too. I have typically seen up to 48 hours for start up on some of my lagers fermented at 50 degrees and with an appropriate starter as well. I agree that you should take a gravity reading see if there is any change and just let it sit. If you don't see any additional activity by the time your LHBS opens next then get another 2206 smack make a starter and pitch it at high krausen. Hang in there hope is not lost yet for you either I believe.

[earthtone]

aight, sounds like good advice. I'll bring it upstairs and take a reading to see. Ken are you calling me a newbie haha, total rookie move eh? just pitching the smackpack when it clearly says on it "the recommended amount of yeast by professional brewers up to 1.060 OG blah blah blah" I know, I should've made a starter but given my time constraints and my dependence on dry ale yeast I just didn't do what I should've. I just thought, well I know my sanitation is good, and I'm doing AG and kegging so even if the yeast doesn't perform optimally I'll still enjoy the results and brew something with the cake. I think the ale practice comment was funny and warranted, I'm a toooootal lager newb. Thanks guys, I'll post back with the gravity soon.

[earthtone]

OK. so. an update - Gravity: 1.050 exactlyTaste: delicious, exactly like it did out of the boil pot with no detectable off flavours of any kindI have brought the carboy back upstairs (ambient temp around 62 df) to take the reading (it's dark in the porch) . Given the above, should I keep it upstairs and let it warm up to see if I get any action out of the yeast I pitched or should I keep it in the porch closer to fridge temps (or actually refrigerate it?) until I have a healthy starter at high krausen?

[BlKtRe]

If you can get your hands on some dry lager yeast quicker, at this point this might be the best save.

[earthtone]

no saflager until thursday either......

[Thirsty]

no saflager until thursday either......

I see a spinoff thread here..."So what strains of dry yeast does everyone keep on hand for emergencies?"

[Slainte]

But don't you think that after 5 days you'd at least have positive pressure in the airlock? I remember (when I was a newbie), just pitching the contents of a White Labs vial into 5 gallons of lager wort. I can't remember how long it took for activity, but it couldn't have been more than 2 days. 5 days seems too long to me.

Not always. Depends on a lot of variables, you can't really say for sure. How did you aerate earthtone?

"So what strains of dry yeast does everyone keep on hand for emergencies?"

None. You don't need dry yeast for emergencies if you make starters and know you have plenty of healthy yeast before brewing.At this point I would either find dry yeast, or build up enough liquid yeast with a starter. Aerate again. If your sanitation was fine, you should be ok...

[Thirsty]

At this point I would either find dry yeast,

isnt that kind of liking keeping some on hand for an emergency?

[Slainte]

isnt that kind of liking keeping some on hand for an emergency?

Sure, but I never said not to. If you just pitch smack packs and cross your fingers, then it might be a good idea to have some packs of dry yeast around always in case. But if you make starters and pitch the right amount of yeast, you'll never need a backup plan because you'll be assured of good yeast health before brewing.

[jayb151]

Sure, but I never said not to. If you just pitch smack packs and cross your fingers, then it might be a good idea to have some packs of dry yeast around always in case. But if you make starters and pitch the right amount of yeast, you'll never need a backup plan because you'll be assured of good yeast health before brewing.

What if you brew, cool, and try to add yeast. But what if your hands are wet with starsan!!Down goes the container of yeast and you are left with two messes to clean up...but wait! You just remembered that packet of dry yeast in your fridge! Here it comes to save the day, and a month later you enjoy the rewards!I'm just messing around, but it brings up a good point. Dry yeast is good for two years after the stamped date, so $2 is pretty good insurance against the exact situation that ET is in.

Edited by jayb151, 01 March 2010 - 08:21 PM.

[Jimmy James]

Was going to say the same as blktre but then read that your SG hasn't budged. I've had this same thing happen with a lager before - then I started making starters for every lager (doesn't help you now but for future reference).What I did in the past that worked for me was to gradually warm it up to 53 degrees and then just left it for a long time. I didn't get to my desired FG but it was beer and after a lagering period was pretty tasty. Also, I never see airlock activity with lagers (though I do see krausen) so taking gravity readings is usually the best way to confirm if it's stuck or not.

Without a gravity reading you have no clue for sure. Also, lager sometimes can take at least 2 weeks to ferment. And at 47*, you may not see much krausen or airlock activity. Sometimes its just slow. Id say take a gravity reading before getting all freaky.