13 replies to this topic

[djinkc]

It seems like more than a few are using a sump pump with ice water for late wort chilling in the summer - at least the IC users. I'm one and would like to see the pump do double duty as a keg cleaner. I know there's a few styles out there, mine has the output right on top. A couple QD's and it shouldn't be to hard to swap it out.......

[jasonrobertcohen]

It seems like more than a few are using a sump pump with ice water for late wort chilling in the summer - at least the IC users. I'm one and would like to see the pump do double duty as a keg cleaner. I know there's a few styles out there, mine has the output right on top. A couple QD's and it shouldn't be to hard to swap it out.......

I have my pump do double duty. There's nothing quite like set it and forget it for keg/carboy cleaning. Of course I still dismantle the keg posts but inverting a keg or carboy over a drilled, capped PVC cleaning wand lets me keep the cleaning solution (PBW, no foaming) in a bucket instead of worrying about lifting the keg or carboy over the sink.I built a cleaning manifold that attaches to the sump pump. It tees off to the side where a ball valve determines whether the two QD lines are getting pump pressure. In this way I can quickly adapt for carboy or keg cleaning. The QDs are too easy to remove/reuse that I do not keep a dedicated set on the cleaning manifold.I cemented threaded ends to the wand portion so I could eventually build a bottle cleaning attachment. I haven't been able to figure out a good way to get small enough sprayers at an affordable cost to build a bottle cleaner that forks off to SIX at a time. PVC is too big and PEX is very odd.... I wonder if I can interface PVC to a thin PEX line?jrc

[xd_haze]

I'd say copper tubing for your bottle cleaner. A little harder to drill, but it'd work.Mike

I have my pump do double duty. There's nothing quite like set it and forget it for keg/carboy cleaning. Of course I still dismantle the keg posts but inverting a keg or carboy over a drilled, capped PVC cleaning wand lets me keep the cleaning solution (PBW, no foaming) in a bucket instead of worrying about lifting the keg or carboy over the sink.I built a cleaning manifold that attaches to the sump pump. It tees off to the side where a ball valve determines whether the two QD lines are getting pump pressure. In this way I can quickly adapt for carboy or keg cleaning. The QDs are too easy to remove/reuse that I do not keep a dedicated set on the cleaning manifold.I cemented threaded ends to the wand portion so I could eventually build a bottle cleaning attachment. I haven't been able to figure out a good way to get small enough sprayers at an affordable cost to build a bottle cleaner that forks off to SIX at a time. PVC is too big and PEX is very odd.... I wonder if I can interface PVC to a thin PEX line?jrc

[Cliff Claven]

https://www.aleiens....-and-keg-washer

[ChefLamont]

I dont have pics of mine, but I will try yo snap some.I just used a submersible (I sprung for another one besides my chiller pump so I can leave it set up....basically because I am lazy) with PVC wands on it. I have different wands for different vessels. When I made them, I capped them with a hole-drilled cap. Then I cut slits in the side of the pvc in arches on the band saw. Just hold the cap end into the saw at a greater than 45 degree angle and cut the notch. That makes a nice spray and the tube stays pretty rigid.

[harryfrog]

https://www.aleiens....-and-keg-washer

The bottom two pictures on this page is exactly how I've got mine setup.I had a couple old keg QDs that weren't the screw kind that I've switched to, so I don't have an inline ball valve.Definately key is either 1/2" PVC or copper. the 3/4" stuff I started with didn't allow for enough flow out of the carboy neck and prevented the water from draining fast enough.I just used 1/2" PVC and went to town drilling holes. It works awesome.

[djinkc]

Thanks guys, keep them coming. Anyone had trouble using PVC instead of CPVC?

[SoopirV]

I found this thread on a Google search, and love the site (so obviously I joined). Here's the thing- I've been a brewer for ~8 years, AG for the last one. I have a homebuilt stand that works well, but could do some things better. It's currently gravity feed, and I was thinking of adding a march pump to the setup to allow recirc during mash (unheated, so no HERMS or RIMS (yet, anyway)), improved cooling, etc. In the mean time, and the reason I'm here, I've noticed that my kegs smell "beer-y" after cleaning and sanitizing. I clean using PBW and hot tap water, but it's all manual. Shake-shake-shake, etc. After this they get plenty of hot water to rinse them out, followed by cool water with BTF to sanitize (and are disassembled as well, throughout the process). I was toying with the idea of building a keg agitator- something out of plywood that connects to a drill via a linkage or the like, but the constantly recirculating spray of cleanser seems more effective. SO, my question: I don't have limitless funds- has anyone ever tried to use a March-type pump as the "one-stop-shop" in the home brewery? I know it can handle mash recirc and can force wort through a chiller, but does it have enough ooomph to wash a keg or a carboy in the manner explained here? I don't know if it's worth mentioning, but I also use the serving keg as secondary (or tertiary) fermenter in all instances. I tried filtering from one keg to another after aging, but the benefit was minimal and I got tired of refilling my CO2 tank all the time (to push the beer from "secondary" to "serving" keg). Maybe prolonged exposure is why my kegs smell? I doubt it, but I want to be honest so I can learn.On a related note, you all seem to be going after the basement-clearing sump pumps (mucho HP). Has anyone tried a smaller pond-type pump? Maybe I can do both- get the $$ March for the sanitary work and get an el cheapo $11 "Utility pump" from Harbor Freight to blast the wares clean?Yes, I know, you get what you pay for, but what I want and need right now is some minor automation to ensure I don't lose my mind.Cheers/Gambin/Skoal/Salud et al....Dave (SoopirV)

Edited by SoopirV, 07 February 2010 - 09:04 PM.

[djinkc]

I found this thread on a Google search..........Dave (SoopirV)

Glad you found the place! I don't think a March pump has the power to really blast a keg or carboy. Never tried cleaning with mine, but once you have a 809 you'll be happy with it. Sometimes I would like a bit more power with it but it does the job for moving water and wort. Don't know what to tell you about the beer smell. My cleaning routine would probably be frowned on around here. Super hot water and elbow grease most of the time. I do take them completely apart but PBW and Oxy don't get used much. Of course I don't let the kegs sit for more than a day or two and never let the crud dry......

[SoopirV]

Glad you found the place! I don't think a March pump has the power to really blast a keg or carboy. Never tried cleaning with mine, but once you have a 809 you'll be happy with it. Sometimes I would like a bit more power with it but it does the job for moving water and wort. Don't know what to tell you about the beer smell. My cleaning routine would probably be frowned on around here. Super hot water and elbow grease most of the time. I do take them completely apart but PBW and Oxy don't get used much. Of course I don't let the kegs sit for more than a day or two and never let the crud dry......

Good advice- I found a 1/6hp pump at Lowe's today for $67 (not on sale). I screwed up when I bought the rest of the supplies and opted for 3/8" hose for the Keg QDs (my ball locks are 1/4", of course!). That's an easy fix, and plan to correct it soon. With that in mind, though, I'm wondering what the "work flow" is of a typical user of a keg washer? Example: Step 1) Drink keg. Step 2) Put keg on washer, run for 20-30 minutes. Step 3) Disassemble keg and...(clean again with brushes? sanitize?). Step 4)...?Lastly, I read somewhere (either here or on ALEin link provided above, can't remember) that someone uses the pump for both recirculating chilling water through an IC and as a keg washer. I would like to try this too- here in Southern AZ our "cold" water is frequently mid-80's in the summer, and even with two coils (one in the wort and one in a bucket of ice water) my cooling time is frustrating (and wasteful). After testing my keg washer with the new pump, I cannot see how my coil(s) would survive the 1400gpm output; I envision leaking/blown hose-to-copper connections on the inlet side. SO...for those that do this: HOW? Is it safe for the pump to put a ball valve on the output to restict flow? Alternatively, I have a 120V varriable transformer, so I can dial back on the power...interestingly (ha!) the associates at Lowe's didn't have any answers. BTW, my primary (ice bath) coil is 3/8", my secondary (wort) coil is 1/4". Maybe I can get sufficient flow by just using my primary coil? Finally, it seems as if the action of pumping adds significant heat to the water, perhaps enough to negate any positive cooling effect (the pump melts the ice as quickly as the incoming hot water)? This is great for cleaning, but worse than bad for chilling...Thanks in advance for any advice!!

[Cliff Claven]

What I have done for cooling is to knock it down as far as possible with your tap water. Then switch to recirculating ice water.You could even toss the 1st 20ish gallons of hot water and add tap water to the pail with the Ice and pump.I have had no problems with a 1/3hp pump and 20ft of 3/8 copper.

[beach]

I cemented threaded ends to the wand portion so I could eventually build a bottle cleaning attachment. I haven't been able to figure out a good way to get small enough sprayers at an affordable cost to build a bottle cleaner that forks off to SIX at a time. PVC is too big and PEX is very odd.... I wonder if I can interface PVC to a thin PEX line?jrc

I built an 8 bottle manifold that fits inside a bucket. I used 1/4" copper tubing with soldered caps and drilled a single hole in the caps for the spray wands. The rest is plumbed in 1/2" cpvc with adapters to go to 1/4". I wish I was able to get pics uploaded to my pc. I built it to sanitize at bottling time and at the time I was using 1-step. I had a issue with 1 batch and promptly swiched to star san. I attached a drop ear ell (thats an elbow with 2 tabs on 1 side with screw holes for mounting)- 1/2" slip x 1/2" female adapter, to the bottom of the bucket. The bottling octopus and a carboy wand both have male adapters on them so I can switch them out. I have a Little Giant pump that moves about 300 gpm that is utilized. I haven't used it since I switched to star san and have been meaning to try it out. Has anyone tried to run star san through a pump? I can envision nothing but foam. Jason, I'm not sure what your idea of affordable is but I think I've got around $50 in fittings and tube plus a bucket invested.Beach

[SoopirV]

I've got two batches under my belt with the new set-up. i've cleaned each of my kegs at least twice since then (it's nice having a new toy!). My pump "self restricts" so forcing 1200gph through 3/8" pipe means nothing (it just pumps slower). What I've noticed is a prolonged chilling time, however; the last batch sat for >3 hours with ice additions, infusions of "cold" water, etc. It seems to me that the single channel path is ineffective. My best success was to feed hot out-flow water into the neck of an ice vessel, but that quickly melted the ice, negating the drop. I didn't have enough ice on hand to help. So, does anyone have experience with two-coil chillers and a pump? How can I best drop the temp of the incoming water?

[3rd party JKor]

I built an 8 bottle manifold that fits inside a bucket. I used 1/4" copper tubing with soldered caps and drilled a single hole in the caps for the spray wands. The rest is plumbed in 1/2" cpvc with adapters to go to 1/4". I wish I was able to get pics uploaded to my pc. I built it to sanitize at bottling time and at the time I was using 1-step. I had a issue with 1 batch and promptly swiched to star san. I attached a drop ear ell (thats an elbow with 2 tabs on 1 side with screw holes for mounting)- 1/2" slip x 1/2" female adapter, to the bottom of the bucket. The bottling octopus and a carboy wand both have male adapters on them so I can switch them out. I have a Little Giant pump that moves about 300 gpm that is utilized. I haven't used it since I switched to star san and have been meaning to try it out. Has anyone tried to run star san through a pump? I can envision nothing but foam. Jason, I'm not sure what your idea of affordable is but I think I've got around $50 in fittings and tube plus a bucket invested.Beach

If you want to pump your sanitizer, you definitely want to pick up some Saniclean, which is the non-foaming version of Star-San.I just built my keg/carboy washer and the next step is a bottle washing rack. With the 1/3hp pump, I'm wondering how many bottle I can wash at once. I bet it'll do a full case at a time if the spray holes are small enough. Now I just have to figure out how build a 24-port manifold that won't cost an arm and a leg.