15 replies to this topic

[Big Nake]

I already have my cinnamon & vanilla Christmas beer in a keg & ready to go, but... my kids were making their annual aromatic holiday projects yesterday where they stick fresh cloves into oranges. My wife puts them around the house during the holidays and they smell lovely. Has anyone made a holiday beer with orange juice and/or zest and fresh cloves thrown in at flameout or in the secondary? Sounds like it could make an awesome Christmas Ale.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I already have my cinnamon & vanilla Christmas beer in a keg & ready to go, but... my kids were making their annual aromatic holiday projects yesterday where they stick fresh cloves into oranges. My wife puts them around the house during the holidays and they smell lovely. Has anyone made a holiday beer with orange juice and/or zest and fresh cloves thrown in at flameout or in the secondary? Sounds like it could make an awesome Christmas Ale.

I think it sounds nice despite the fact that I'm not huge on spice additions.

[Thirsty]

Well if you count the extraction of clove phenols from many Belgian yeast characters, there are some very nice Belgian Xmas beers that incorporate oranges as well. Oerbier's Stille Nacht is one of them. I really enjoy this beer. I went somewhat this direction this year for holiday beer adding oranges and Belgian yeast (3522 Ardennes) to a porter. So I should get some clove and orange in that.

[Big Nake]

Well if you count the extraction of clove phenols from many Belgian yeast characters, there are some very nice Belgian Xmas beers that incorporate oranges as well. Oerbier's Stille Nacht is one of them. I really enjoy this beer. I went somewhat this direction this year for holiday beer adding oranges and Belgian yeast (3522 Ardennes) to a porter. So I should get some clove and orange in that.

Yeah, that sounds good. Some of the spiced beers I've had seem to go overboard on the spice. I have a hard time telling what's in it if there are 15 different spices in the beer. There was something by Sam Adams called Old Fezziwig... do they still make that? I think it had some orange in it too. How did you add the orange (juice/zest?) and how much? For anyone that has added actual cloves to a beer, how much, how did you prepare them and where did you add them? I could see boiling a small amount of water and then turning it off and adding a tablespoon or 2 of cloves and putting the lid on to let it steep. Then take the zest and juice of 2-3 oranges and add that to the pot too. Let it cool and add that to the secondary and rack the beer on top. The beer would have to be lightly hopped so the rest of the flavor could come through. Maybe I'll try it & see what happens. Cheers.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Yeah, that sounds good. Some of the spiced beers I've had seem to go overboard on the spice. I have a hard time telling what's in it if there are 15 different spices in the beer. There was something by Sam Adams called Old Fezziwig... do they still make that? I think it had some orange in it too. How did you add the orange (juice/zest?) and how much? For anyone that has added actual cloves to a beer, how much, how did you prepare them and where did you add them? I could see boiling a small amount of water and then turning it off and adding a tablespoon or 2 of cloves and putting the lid on to let it steep. Then take the zest and juice of 2-3 oranges and add that to the pot too. Let it cool and add that to the secondary and rack the beer on top. The beer would have to be lightly hopped so the rest of the flavor could come through. Maybe I'll try it & see what happens. Cheers.

I think they might still make old fezziwig seasonally. I wasn't a huge fan of that one if I remember correctly.

[Thirsty]

How did you add the orange (juice/zest?) and how much? For anyone that has added actual cloves to a beer, how much, how did you prepare them and where did you add them?

I use a potato peeler and peel off 2 full oranges worth of zest, leaving the pith behind. I have also made AlphaMale's Liquid Stupid a couple times, and I add the orange the same way. That recipe is actually pretty close to a xmas type Belgian as well, but with corriander and ginger. I ironically cracked one last night to see how it mellowed since spring, and it is right there. Gonna have another tonight in fact!! :cheers:Forgot that is for a 13 gallon batch size and I add 5 minutes out.

Edited by Thirsty, 28 November 2009 - 03:50 PM.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I use a potato peeler and peel off 2 full oranges worth of zest, leaving the pith behind. I have also made AlphaMale's Liquid Stupid a couple times, and I add the orange the same way. That recipe is actually pretty close to a xmas type Belgian as well, but with corriander and ginger. I ironically cracked one last night to see how it mellowed since spring, and it is right there. Gonna have another tonight in fact!! :cheers:Forgot that is for a 13 gallon batch size and I add 5 minutes out.

sounds pretty hipster

[harryfrog]

I just kegged this beer two weeks ago - and found it delicious.For a 5 gallon batch, I added to secondary:1 tsp ground clove1 tsp ground cinnamon1 tsp ground nutmeg2 oz vodka infused for 24 hours with zest from a medium sized orange (just zest - no white whatsoever)I had done other spice additions which I found added nothing to the beer. I did add bitter orange peel to the boil pot - and I think this comes out as a residual bitterness in the beer - of course, I can't tell if it is that addition or the orange vodka infusionThe beer has a wonderfully mild orange aroma that complements the cinnamon and nutmeg and clove. The only way to describe the beer is "wow, tastes like Christmas"I find the orange is barely noticeable at 34F, but as the beer warms slightly you just percieve it.Delicious.Beer was a malt forward beer, 1.066 OG, 1.012 FG, 30 IBUs. It's kind of funny making a Christmas session beer.

[Stout_fan]

Well Clove, orange, throw in some Grains of Paradise and Ground Coriander on top of a ton of Pilsner malt and you have Maudite.

[Deerslyr]

I've only used cloves a couple of times. The first time was a disaster because I used to heavy a hand on the cloves. Tasted horrible. Second time I was more conservative and used other spices in addition (first time was cloves only). Was a much better beer.

[Stout_fan]

Deerslyr, it's easy to overdo the cloves. That was one very good point worth mentioning.

[Marmot]

My only experience with cloves is from St Nick's Holiday Ale from that other brewing site. My ProMash recipe has 1/4 tsp 15 minutes prior to flame out. I think the recipe used to call for more, but it was reduced by the author/vendor. I am thinking the rule of thumb is to tread lightly with cloves to ensure it doesn't overpower the beer as noted by Deerslyr and Stout_fan.Marmot

[Stout_fan]

The Maudite is a 12.5 gal batch of 1.076 OG IIRC. I used 7 cloves and about 8 gm of GOP.And that's a really spicy beer.

[xd_haze]

Yes, easy on the clove, if you use it at all, with belgian yeasts. I have a belgian fermented with Ardennes on tap now that tastes like a ton of clove was added. Only, none was!mike

My only experience with cloves is from St Nick's Holiday Ale from that other brewing site. My ProMash recipe has 1/4 tsp 15 minutes prior to flame out. I think the recipe used to call for more, but it was reduced by the author/vendor. I am thinking the rule of thumb is to tread lightly with cloves to ensure it doesn't overpower the beer as noted by Deerslyr and Stout_fan.Marmot

[Big Nake]

OMG, 7 cloves? They do smell very assertive when you're holding them in your hand, but I had no idea it would be a situation where you counted the cloves as opposed to measuring them out. My thought was to add them at flameout and leave them in the brewpot with the lid on and heat off and also to throw the orange zest and/or juice in there at the same time. I would use a more neutral yeast but thanks for the heads-up on the clove... I wouldn't want the beer to be like sucking on a NECCO wafer! Cheers.

[strangebrewer]

OMG, 7 cloves? They do smell very assertive when you're holding them in your hand, but I had no idea it would be a situation where you counted the cloves as opposed to measuring them out. My thought was to add them at flameout and leave them in the brewpot with the lid on and heat off and also to throw the orange zest and/or juice in there at the same time. I would use a more neutral yeast but thanks for the heads-up on the clove... I wouldn't want the beer to be like sucking on a NECCO wafer! Cheers.

I've counted cloves before as well adding them to beer's and meads. They are that potent. Cardamom is another spice that falls in the same 'use withe caution' category IMO. I add cloves to the boil but citrus I zest into a little vodka and add the whole mess during primary or secondary. When I want citrus in a beer (and I don't want cascade/amarillo) I want it on the nose more than the palate so I do everything possible to keep the aroma intact. I've had good success with a combination use of a saison yeast and vodka/zest slurry mentioned above.Just be sure to wash your citrus fruits really well as I've found some store bought stuff to have a pretty tough layer of wax on them.