11 replies to this topic

[chuck_d]

The Brewers Association recently sent all their members a copy of their new Draft Beer Qaulity Manual, and launched a website along with it. You can download a PDF and/or browse the site...Draught Beer Quality Manual

[Recklessdeck]

This is good stuff, thanks for the link chuck

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

The Brewers Association recently sent all their members a copy of their new Draft Beer Qaulity Manual, and launched a website along with it. You can download a PDF and/or browse the site...Draught Beer Quality Manual

sweet!

[chuck_d]

Yeah, I just had to post on my Journal about this too... The printed version is so nice, it is all glossy.

Edited by chuck_d, 17 June 2009 - 04:46 PM.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I was just reading the balancing section and it seems like I'd need to crank my CO2 WAY up to balance out the system. Someone can correct the math for me if I'm wrong...vertical lift (center of keg to tap) = 2.5 feetlength of 3/16 vinyl = 6 feettotal static resistance = 2.5*0.5 + 6*3 = 19.25 PSI which for me would be some REALLY carbonated beer.Does this sound right? Should I be using much shorter length beer lines? Maybe 3 feet of tubing so I'd get something like 2.5*0.5 + 3*3 = 10.25 PSI? Do you guys use QDs or something to vary the length of your tubing? It would be a real bitch for me to swap the tubing out all of the time b/c it's pretty tight inside my draft arm to get to the the elbow shanks.

[chuck_d]

Well, this came up elsewhere, in the table they give for the resistence of various tubings they make a note that those values are for example/ballparking only and that you should check with your manufacturer to find out the restriction for whatever tubing you actually do use as they vary between manufacturers. I know from experience that not all 3/16" ID line is the same. I used to have a bunch from micromatic, my kegerator was in balance. Then I built a new line of the same length with MB's line, both lines called themselves 3/16" ID vinyl, yet their diameter isn't even the same. When I put epoxy mixer in the micromatic line I would have to jam in there hard, even use a pen to push it all the way in. The epoxy mixer just falls into the MB line and slides around. Anyways, I built the line the same way (this was a line without epoxy mixer at first, my low pressure line) and the MB line of course provided WAY less restriction and the same beer on the same pressure. The beer exploded into my glass basically. As part of my kegerator design, what I was going to do is have these little unions in the middle allowing me to swap in and out various amounts of epoxy mixer to create the amount of flow restriction that I needed, in the end I discovered flow control faucets and so will be using those shortly. That will mean the type & length of line doesn't matter. So in the end, if you are going to use line to balance, and you don't have the value from the manufacturer, then balancing is a little bit of an art but the various numbers used by people will get you in the ballpark. I say if you like the way your kegerator pours, then that's what matters.

Edited by chuck_d, 20 June 2009 - 12:13 PM.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Well, this came up elsewhere, in the table they give for the resistence of various tubings they make a note that those values are for example/ballparking only and that you should check with your manufacturer to find out the restriction for whatever tubing you actually do use as they vary between manufacturers. I know from experience that not all 3/16" ID line is the same. I used to have a bunch from micromatic, my kegerator was in balance. Then I built a new line of the same length with MB's line, both lines called themselves 3/16" ID vinyl, yet their diameter isn't even the same. When I put epoxy mixer in the micromatic line I would have to jam in there hard, even use a pen to push it all the way in. The epoxy mixer just falls into the MB line and slides around. Anyways, I built the line the same way (this was a line without epoxy mixer at first, my low pressure line) and the MB line of course provided WAY less restriction and the same beer on the same pressure. The beer exploded into my glass basically. As part of my kegerator design, what I was going to do is have these little unions in the middle allowing me to swap in and out various amounts of epoxy mixer to create the amount of flow restriction that I needed, in the end I discovered flow control faucets and so will be using those shortly. That will mean the type & length of line doesn't matter. So in the end, if you are going to use line to balance, and you don't have the value from the manufacturer, then balancing is a little bit of an art but the various numbers used by people will get you in the ballpark. I say if you like the way your kegerator pours, then that's what matters.

The only reasonable solution I see to serving different styles of beer is to have the flow control faucets but I already bought these totally sweet ventmatics

[chuck_d]

The only reasonable solution I see to serving different styles of beer is to have the flow control faucets but I already bought these totally sweet ventmatics

Yeah, I mean, in a homebrewpub, at least mine, my faucet will pour beers that I want to server at vastly different carbonation levels, so putting the flow control in the faucet makes a lot of sense for me. I'm moving my ventmatic and perlicks to a jockey box I'm building for my friend's wedding. In a bar, a faucet may never even serve a different beer, and when only one beer goes through a faucet you just need to balance it once.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Yeah, I mean, in a homebrewpub, at least mine, my faucet will pour beers that I want to server at vastly different carbonation levels, so putting the flow control in the faucet makes a lot of sense for me. I'm moving my ventmatic and perlicks to a jockey box I'm building for my friend's wedding. In a bar, a faucet may never even serve a different beer, and when only one beer goes through a faucet you just need to balance it once.

Sounds like a fun project. Make sure to post something about it later on

[No Party JKor]

Well, this came up elsewhere, in the table they give for the resistence of various tubings they make a note that those values are for example/ballparking only and that you should check with your manufacturer to find out the restriction for whatever tubing you actually do use as they vary between manufacturers. I know from experience that not all 3/16" ID line is the same. I used to have a bunch from micromatic, my kegerator was in balance. Then I built a new line of the same length with MB's line, both lines called themselves 3/16" ID vinyl, yet their diameter isn't even the same. When I put epoxy mixer in the micromatic line I would have to jam in there hard, even use a pen to push it all the way in. The epoxy mixer just falls into the MB line and slides around. Anyways, I built the line the same way (this was a line without epoxy mixer at first, my low pressure line) and the MB line of course provided WAY less restriction and the same beer on the same pressure. The beer exploded into my glass basically. As part of my kegerator design, what I was going to do is have these little unions in the middle allowing me to swap in and out various amounts of epoxy mixer to create the amount of flow restriction that I needed, in the end I discovered flow control faucets and so will be using those shortly. That will mean the type & length of line doesn't matter. So in the end, if you are going to use line to balance, and you don't have the value from the manufacturer, then balancing is a little bit of an art but the various numbers used by people will get you in the ballpark. I say if you like the way your kegerator pours, then that's what matters.

Huh, I never heard of the epoxy mixer method. It's a good idea. You just bought a pack of nozzles and pulled the mixer?

[chuck_d]

Huh, I never heard of the epoxy mixer method. It's a good idea. You just bought a pack of nozzles and pulled the mixer?

Yup. I think the original idea came from a maltose falcons page, but I've seen it around. Their design involves splicing in 1/4" line with epoxy mixer, but I just bought 3/16" nozzles from mcmaster and stick them right in the lines. It's extremely useful for building cobra/picnic taps. I find like 18-24" a nice length for line in terms of ease of use, and just jam as much of this as is needed in there and test the pour. If it's too slow I take some out, too fast put more in but you don't need crazy long lines or crazy low pressures that slowly decarb your beer. It's definitely a trial & error kind of thing to find the right balance, but once you're set it should be good for a range of pressures, but you can make like a low pressure cobra tap and a high pressure cobra tap. Lemme dig up the part number...https://www.mcmaster.com/#74695A57

Edited by chuck_d, 20 June 2009 - 06:57 PM.

[No Party JKor]

I have a bunch of the mixer nozzles in my lab left over from a project I was working on. I'll check to see if they're the right size.