21 replies to this topic

[Big Nake]

Ashton Lewis wrote a short article on water chemistry this month which talks about using RO/distilled water, the effects of hard & soft water, etc. I had seen most of these ideas before but somewhere late in the article he was talking about sodium. He said that sodium doesn't bring a "salty" character to beer until it's over 40ppm and that at lower levels it can accentuate sweetness and "palate fullness". He also said that he likes to add 10ppm Kosher Salt to the mash, especially for pale lagers. I like to use the EZ_Water spreadsheet to get an idea of where my water ions are for each batch but there is no Kosher Salt category... just a "Table Salt" (NaCl) category. Would I be able to use that column to add Kosher Salt if I were inclined to try it?

[positiveContact]

Ashton Lewis wrote a short article on water chemistry this month which talks about using RO/distilled water, the effects of hard & soft water, etc. I had seen most of these ideas before but somewhere late in the article he was talking about sodium. He said that sodium doesn't bring a "salty" character to beer until it's over 40ppm and that at lower levels it can accentuate sweetness and "palate fullness". He also said that he likes to add 10ppm Kosher Salt to the mash, especially for pale lagers. I like to use the EZ_Water spreadsheet to get an idea of where my water ions are for each batch but there is no Kosher Salt category... just a "Table Salt" (NaCl) category. Would I be able to use that column to add Kosher Salt if I were inclined to try it?

I think they are both NaCl.My link

Like common table salt, kosher salt consists of the chemical compound sodium chloride.

[shaggaroo]

NaCl is NaCl is NaCl

[Murphy]

NaCl is NaCl is NaCl

partial credit. table salt can also contain potassium or sodium idiode and can also contain an anticaking agent such as calium silicate. Kosher salt is NaCl with no additives.

[Big Nake]

Hooray! I should have clarified that the shreadsheet specifically says NON-IODIZED salt. Okay, thanks for the confirmation on that. I guess the next question would be... how many of you brewers use Kosher Salt in a beer, what is the purpose (or what does it bring to the beer) and are you using it with a specific water profile where it's needed? The sodium number in my tap water is 13. When I make a pale lager I typically use all distilled water so my sodium number may be ZERO after additions of Calcium Chloride and Magnesium Sulfate. I can't say that I have ever seen anything saying that there should be a certain amount of sodium in the production of a pale lager. Cheers!

[positiveContact]

Hooray! I should have clarified that the shreadsheet specifically says NON-IODIZED salt. Okay, thanks for the confirmation on that. I guess the next question would be... how many of you brewers use Kosher Salt in a beer, what is the purpose (or what does it bring to the beer) and are you using it with a specific water profile where it's needed? The sodium number in my tap water is 13. When I make a pale lager I typically use all distilled water so my sodium number may be ZERO after additions of Calcium Chloride and Magnesium Sulfate. I can't say that I have ever seen anything saying that there should be a certain amount of sodium in the production of a pale lager. Cheers!

never used it personally - i use chalk, gypsum, calcium chloride, and baking soda.

[Murphy]

this is pure speculation but Na+ is partially/mostly responsible for some flavor enhancement as seen in NaCl, MSG, Sodium Glycinate, etc. Pale lagers are not made with extremely "flavorfully" components such as roasted malts, lots of hops, adjuncts, so the potential addition of NaCl can give the subtle taste profile a little extra kick.just a thought.

[MtnBrewer]

Non-iodized because iodine is toxic to yeast. (Iodophor anyone?) However the amount of iodine in salt is unlikely to have any harmful effects.

[Big Nake]

Okay, good to know. So does anyone have any experience with adding Kosher salt to the mash of a pale lager? Does anyone have an opinion on beers in this style that may have a sodium number of ZERO? I just made a few beers like this (with all distilled water) and the sodium number for all of them was ZERO. None of these beers have hit the taps yet but I wonder what the Kosher Salt would add or what the lack of sodium in a beer would do. Thoughts?

[MtnBrewer]

Okay, good to know. So does anyone have any experience with adding Kosher salt to the mash of a pale lager? Does anyone have an opinion on beers in this style that may have a sodium number of ZERO? I just made a few beers like this (with all distilled water) and the sodium number for all of them was ZERO. None of these beers have hit the taps yet but I wonder what the Kosher Salt would add or what the lack of sodium in a beer would do. Thoughts?

Taste your beer, then sprinkle a little bit of table salt into the glass. Taste again and note the difference.

[harryfrog]

Ken - you've been to mexico so you must have added salt to your beer at some point in your life...what did you think?I have never brewed a lager with a salt addition, but I'm thinking about it now. I wonder if I could get some guacamole flavor in there too???

[denny]

I wonder if I could get some guacamole flavor in there too???

Drew Beechum was serving a guacamole saison at NHC.

[positiveContact]

Drew Beechum was serving a guacamole saison at NHC.

how was it? doesn't sound good to me but you never know...

[Big Nake]

I have a couple of gold lagers coming up and I am considering a small Kosher Salt addition. I have a gold lager on tap right now too and I could do the sprinkle test and see what I think.Harryfrog: Every time I ordered a beer in Mexico, I also got a cup of limes and packets of salt but I never added the salt. Probably my mistake but I never really thought about it.

[denny]

how was it? doesn't sound good to me but you never know...

Fantastically good.

[tag]

I have a couple of gold lagers coming up and I am considering a small Kosher Salt addition. I have a gold lager on tap right now too and I could do the sprinkle test and see what I think.

You might dissolve it first so it doesn't cause foaming and effect the carbonation level.

[Murphy]

Fantastically good.

really? it sounds gross but I would certainly give it a try.

[Big Nake]

On the topic of the guacamole saison... I have to wonder how someone could possiblly get guacamole flavor in a beer. I just made some guac the other day (avocado, onion, tomato, some McCormick mix, the juice from one lime, etc) but I don't see this working in a beer unless there is something I'm not considering. Is it possible that he used a mix and just added the mix at flameout or in the secondary and that's it? I'mjust thinking out loud here.Okay, get this. One of my kegs blew last night and this morning I cleaned it out, sanitized it and racked a cold "gold lager" into that keg and let it sit in the fridge for about 6 hours. Then I whipped up a batch of gel solution and added a pinch or two of kosher salt to the water I used to heat the gel. I know this is not a real effective way to test this and my guess is that it will not be enough to even have an impact on flavor. But if this batch of gold lager has a certain... I don't know what..., maybe it's the kosher salt. Cheers!

[denny]

I wouldn't say it had a distinct guacamole flavor, but it was made with guacamole ingredients. No mix, individual ingredients. It was one of 14 saisons present at NHC by Drew Beechum, the master of saison. If you'd like more info, head on over to the AHA forum and ask him.

Edited by denny, 24 June 2011 - 02:21 PM.

[Big Nake]

I've added salt to a chocolate stout of mine before. Salt enhances flavours, and you always see salt in recipes like brownies. I think it added something - made the chocolate more pronounced. I think I used a teaspoon in 5 gallons.

I would agree that salt enhances flavor. I am always willing to try these additions because I want to taste what they add to various beer styles. I think that the beer I make next week will include a kosher salt addition. As I was playing with the EZ_Water sheet, I noticed that as I added Kosher Salt (or Non-Iodized salt) to the mash, it leaned my Chloride-to-Sulfate ratio towards the malty side which I did not expect. I see that the sheet clearly shows that salt "raises Cl:So ratio" but it surprised me. I'm going to look into it a little further and then report back. Thanks for all the great responses gang. Happy Friday Beerheads.