11 replies to this topic

[Deerslyr]

Ok, so I want to brew my next beer as a Black Lager. I'm using one of Ken Lenard's recipes as a base and making a modification to it to darken it up significantly. Here is Ken's original grain bill calls for

5 lbs Pilsner Malt or American 2-row Pale Malt3 lbs Munich Light1 lb Flaked Corn6 oz Belgian Caramunich2 oz Debittered Black Malt (mash temp 150-151°)

I have modified it to this

6.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 60.00 % 2.00 lb Munich Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 20.00 % 1.00 lb Corn, Flaked (1.3 SRM) Grain 10.00 % 0.50 lb Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 5.00 % 0.50 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 5.00 %

Ken and I have had a few PM's on it. My intent is to acheive a very dark color without getting too heavy on a "roast" type flavor. Ken did suggest using Sinamar to acheive the darkness and avoid that. (I do note that I intend to use Debittered Black Malt instead of Patent, but BeerSmith did not have that as an option.) What are the thoughts and comments on acheiving dark colors in lagers while minimizing the roast flavor?

[cavman]

Ok, so I want to brew my next beer as a Black Lager. I'm using one of Ken Lenard's recipes as a base and making a modification to it to darken it up significantly. Here is Ken's original grain bill calls forI have modified it to thisKen and I have had a few PM's on it. My intent is to acheive a very dark color without getting too heavy on a "roast" type flavor. Ken did suggest using Sinamar to acheive the darkness and avoid that. (I do note that I intend to use Debittered Black Malt instead of Patent, but BeerSmith did not have that as an option.) What are the thoughts and comments on acheiving dark colors in lagers while minimizing the roast flavor?

You could use the dehusked Carafa III, for Beersmith not having an ingredient you can manually enter it into the program rather easily.

[Deerslyr]

You could use the dehusked Carafa III, for Beersmith not having an ingredient you can manually enter it into the program rather easily.

I was in a rush formulating last night. Still a week or so from brewing, but was just lazy about finding all the data and inputting it last night. I will try to re-run it with Carafa III. At this point, I'm still in recipe development phase, so I'm open to all options.

Edited by Deerslyr, 22 October 2010 - 09:07 AM.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I was in a rush formulating last night. Still a week or so from brewing, but was just lazy about finding all the data and inputting it last night. I will try to re-run it with Carafa III. At this point, I'm still in recipe development phase, so I'm open to all options.

carafa III and debittered black are the options I've used. If you keep the amounts low you should be good to go.

[ncbeerbrewer]

Agreed. Go with the Carafa as suggested above. If it were me I would drop the Black Patent and sub in .5lb of Carafa

[aquahijo]

I don't post here very often but I thought I would share my experiences on this one. I made a Black IPA a month or two ago and faced the same problem. I wanted a roasty flavor and dark color without going overboard.My Black IPA recipe uses 8oz's of Carafa III cold steeped over night and added it to the last 15 mins of the boil. This gave me a little roast without being over-kill and the dark coloring I wanted. I soaked the 8oz's in a 32 oz Nalgene filled with tap water overnight for aprox 18 hours. I used a coffee press to strain the liquid off from the Carafa and collect about 16oz's of liquid. I think next time I may increase the 8oz's to 12oz's to get a little more color and roast next time. My finished beer was a little more dark brown/red than I would have like but it was pretty close and it has the roast flavor I was looking for. I also had 4oz Carafa III in the mash that was sprinkled on top.Cheers!Luke

[Steve Urquell]

I always cap the mash with mine about 10mins. before the runoff. Keeps the roast down but gives the full color amount.

[Jimmy James]

+1 on what Luke wrote. I don't think 12 oz would be too much either. You can pulverize the heck out of the carafa - grind it almost to a powder and then steep in cold water and strain through a coffee filter into your boil. Or, you can just pulverize it and throw it right on top of the mash.

[Deerslyr]

I always cap the mash with mine about 10mins. before the runoff. Keeps the roast down but gives the full color amount.

+1 on what Luke wrote. I don't think 12 oz would be too much either. You can pulverize the heck out of the carafa - grind it almost to a powder and then steep in cold water and strain through a coffee filter into your boil. Or, you can just pulverize it and throw it right on top of the mash.

If it goes in the mash... stir in 10 minutes before runoff?I've got a french press and may be inclined to put it to use. I just don't want to come up short on the SRM.

[Steve Urquell]

If it goes in the mash... stir in 10 minutes before runoff?I've got a french press and may be inclined to put it to use. I just don't want to come up short on the SRM.

I don't cold steep or anything special. I just keep it separated from the rest of the grains when I mill and stir the dry grain into the mash 10 mins. b4 runoff.I've done several black lager 5gal.batches with 5ozs. each of carafa II and choc. malt and each came out with a very mild roast character. I did a dark IPA (7gal batch)with 8oz. of Carafa I which ended up with no roast character and dark brown color (22SRM)

[Steve Urquell]

Here's some pron BTW. My wife has almost singlehandedly drank two batches of this beer. She says it reminds her of her chocolate coffees. Did mine with w-34 dry lager yeast.

[djinkc]

Agreed. Go with the Carafa as suggested above. If it were me I would drop the Black Patent and sub in .5lb of Carafa

I did basically the same thing with a Black Ale. 1/2# Carafa III should be fine. I would just mash it with everything else. Black patent would blow you out of the water....