35 replies to this topic

[Thirsty]

I am still mixed about entering it. Its a South Carolina comp. on their website it reads:--11th Annual Palmetto State Brewers' Open--Palmetto State Brewers is once again pleased to have been chosen as a qualifying competition for the Masters' Championship of Amateur Brewing XII (the MCAB). Winners of 1st place in BJCP categories 1-19 and 22 will be eligible for the MCAB national competition.No 23 will not qualify....BOOOOOO!!! I may be better off entering my Marzen as it seems MUCH closer to style.

If it is a good tasting beer, definitely get it in there, once you get a placing, and an invitation to the MCAB, it dosnt matter what subcat you enter, you have the ability to place a beer anywhere in that category. Meaning if you win in the ofest/marzen, you can then enter the same style or a vienna lager, as long as it is a category 3 beer.

[No Party JKor]

I am still mixed about entering it. Its a South Carolina comp. on their website it reads:--11th Annual Palmetto State Brewers' Open--Palmetto State Brewers is once again pleased to have been chosen as a qualifying competition for the Masters' Championship of Amateur Brewing XII (the MCAB). Winners of 1st place in BJCP categories 1-19 and 22 will be eligible for the MCAB national competition.cat. 23 will not qualify....BOOOOOO!!! I may be better off entering my Marzen as it seems MUCH closer to style.And yes this lager is still green with a ton of sulphur but its clean with a little toasty on the back end. Its seems like it may not be the right place to showcase such a brew. cat. 23 gets no respect it seems.

Just enter it as a Vienna. You're overthinking this. Enter your Marzen, too.

[MtnBrewer]

Its possible it could be passed as a vienna lager. If its ready in time it just may pass.cant imagine too many viennas will be entered.

All of the Cat 3 beers will be judged together. In other words, it will be competing with o'fests too, not just other Viennas.

[Sidney Porter]

I have to disagree. 23 is a catchall, not extreme beers. Many brewere make extreme beers and enter them here, but the judging is not subjective, the entries are not compared to eachother, but instead compared to the guidelines. If there is a traditional recipe, but a nontraditional ingredient or process- and the beer tastes good, then it should do well regardless of the other entries. the nontraditional factor does not need to be off the wall out of the box, it just needs to be unacceptable in its traditional style. Now if you used pilsner malt and lightly toasted it to vienna color, then I would say different, however vienna should not yield any roast flavor, so to notice it is kilned too far. I am taking the exam on saturday, FWIW if I draw cat 23 to make my recipe question, I will submit a hometoasted Vienna lager and see how it does!!

Good luck on the exam. I agree with what you are saying about cat 23 but I don't see it in practice. Less intense beers seem to score lower in all categories but it it has more impact in categories where you are head to head with more intense beers (cat 16 is another example, as well as the fruit, herb spice, and to a lesser degree wood/smoke). I say that wood/smoke also runs a chance of a judge perceiving it too strong even when it isn't.In most categories it doesn't matter if if it is scored lower because everything in the flight was under the constraints. For example the flavor and aroma in cat 1 seem to score lower than say a comparable quality beer would in cat 18. This isn't right but it seem to be consistent with a lot of comps.Where it hurt is when the cat has intense beers and less intense going head to head. the judges go thru their flight of say 10 beers, now that they are on paper the little extra that the more intense beers got are going to be higher scoring on the flight summary, it is also the beers that probably stood out in their memory. There might be some additional idscussion about the top 4 are they in the correct order, etc but the less intense beer that they gave a 38 to is probably not even making it to the conversation with the 42s and 43.

[Thirsty]

Good luck on the exam. Where it hurt is when the cat has intense beers and less intense going head to head. the judges go thru their flight of say 10 beers, now that they are on paper the little extra that the more intense beers got are going to be higher scoring on the flight summary, it is also the beers that probably stood out in their memory. There might be some additional idscussion about the top 4 are they in the correct order, etc but the less intense beer that they gave a 38 to is probably not even making it to the conversation with the 42s and 43.

Thanks, I think I am well studied and prepared, but I would really like to score high the first time, I have between 7-8 experience points, so if I can break 80, national is not too far off in the future. Rather take it once.I can completely agree with you on this point, with the caveat being a comp that is producing 40-43 scoring entries. When judging good quality beers, then the standouts would probably prevail. However an example was at the SA longshot this year. I got to do 23 for the afternnon session and the judge I was with said at the beginning "23 huh, God help us" Once we dove into a few I understood what he was saying. Some HBers try their hardest to make such an extreme beer they go way over the top, and make some horrible decisions. One beer we judged (sorry if I offend anyone's recipe here) was a 100% molasses as fermentables. It was freakin mud! Poured out of the bottle in glops! Not that all comps are like this, and I am sure many cat 23s are outstanding, but in my opinions, I am looking for subtlty, not re-invention.When talking with a few Master judges, they all seem to prefer to judge, (and respect) the lighter delicate beers most. Not so much because of the fact that flaws are more recognizable, but when you do find a really good one, chances are it is an outstanding example of the style. That leads me to the debate of competition beer in general. As HBers 80% of what most of us do is experimental or hybrid, or adjusted somehow from the traditional style profile. That is what we do- because we can, and because it allows us the creative freedom. However most of these beers will not fit the guidelines, either by gravity, ingredients or a characteristic. When brewing beer for comp, a decision should be made as you are formulating the recipe- am I going to submit this so I can win? Or am I going to submit this just so I can get feedback as to if this recipe is tasty and unique? If it is to win, then some of the creativity may need to be restrained.

[Sidney Porter]

Thanks, I think I am well studied and prepared, but I would really like to score high the first time, I have between 7-8 experience points, so if I can break 80, national is not too far off in the future. Rather take it once.

You could have the experience point before you get you test results! When I took in in 2007 it took 4.5 mos to get the results. I re-took it 1st week of may this year still waiting

[MtnBrewer]

Thanks, I think I am well studied and prepared, but I would really like to score high the first time, I have between 7-8 experience points, so if I can break 80, national is not too far off in the future. Rather take it once.

I thought that you had to take the test again to move up in rank even if you already have the experience points.

[Sidney Porter]

I thought that you had to take the test again to move up in rank even if you already have the experience points.

You rank is made up of your score and experience points. I scored a 75 when I took it but had 0 points, so I started out as recognized and then automatically went to certified after getting 5 points.So if thirsty score an 80+ he would start out certified (assuming he has 7 points) after he gets to 20 would be national.

[MtnBrewer]

You rank is made up of your score and experience points.

Yeah, I realize that.

I scored a 75 when I took it but had 0 points, so I started out as recognized and then automatically went to certified after getting 5 points.So if thirsty score an 80+ he would start out certified (assuming he has 7 points) after he gets to 20 would be national.

That's good. I was told that you had to re-take the test to move up even if your previous score qualified you for a higher rank. That never made sense to me so I'm glad that's not how it works.

[Thirsty]

This was taken off the exam center portion of the BJCP site under the link for new judge's packet:Personal Judge Record: A copy of your BJCP record showing your personal information, including any experience points you have accumulated, as it appears in the BJCP database. First time takers frequently have very few or no points listed. If you would like to include points retroactively, contact the IT Director to request the points. Note that the IT Director does a search of competition records for retroactive points for every new judge, so you may wish to wait a month or two to see if your records get transferred. Judges can verify their experience points as they earn them by viewing their judge record using our web application. Please examine your record and verify the contents, particularly the email address. If you note any errors, use the Change-of-Address web application to correct them.Well, 5 more hours and it will all be done! I am bringing a nice year cellared oak aged RIS to share and celebrate when its all over.

[Sidney Porter]

This was taken off the exam center portion of the BJCP site under the link for new judge's packet:Personal Judge Record: A copy of your BJCP record showing your personal information, including any experience points you have accumulated, as it appears in the BJCP database. First time takers frequently have very few or no points listed. If you would like to include points retroactively, contact the IT Director to request the points. Note that the IT Director does a search of competition records for retroactive points for every new judge, so you may wish to wait a month or two to see if your records get transferred. Judges can verify their experience points as they earn them by viewing their judge record using our web application. Please examine your record and verify the contents, particularly the email address. If you note any errors, use the Change-of-Address web application to correct them.Well, 5 more hours and it will all be done! I am bringing a nice year cellared oak aged RIS to share and celebrate when its all over.

You will want to follow up on the points. When you do the points for a comp you submit their bjcp# and name, type of points, and number of points. The bjcp# is the unique number in the dB. So points prior to getting your number is manual search, could have misspelled names etc, if you tell them what comp they should be able to figure it out.The online records are not real time they are updated 1x per month give or take.You should get you bjcp # about a month after you take the exam. So you will not need to wait for your reslts for that. I beleive once you get your number you can start putting apprentice as your rank, since that rank doesn't require a score.

[Thirsty]

Thanks for the tips!