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#1 ER Pemberton

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 05:51 AM

I'm checking in with those who are making lagers to see what you've been doing with regard to primary.  Are most of you still doing the 4-5 days (or close to 50% of fermentation done) at the lower temp (50° or so) and then taking the primary out of the cool spot to finish up?  This was the "quick lager method" mentioned by numerous popular brewers and just curious who is following this method.  If I have kegs of beer in a queue, they are going to sit cold, kegged and carbed for a good 4-6 weeks most of the time anyway but just curious who is doing this and who is allowing the lager to sit cool during the entire primary time.  I'm still a believer in having the lager warm up for some amount of time to avoid diacetyl.  



#2 Bklmt2000

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 06:05 AM

My method: 10-14 days in primary, with first 2/3 being cool, then I let the temp rise for 2-4 days to ~68-70 to let the yeast eat up any diacetyl and clean up the beer.

 

Then I put the primary (Ale Pail) into the lager fridge for 2 solid weeks, then keg.

 

For my lagers <6%, if the lager tastes good/ready to drink at kegging, it goes on tap as soon as room is available. 

 

Stronger lagers (like the 8% d-bock I kegged last week) will get another 1-2 months in the cold.


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#3 ER Pemberton

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 06:11 AM

My method: 10-14 days in primary, with first 2/3 being cool, then I let the temp rise for 2-4 days to ~68-70 to let the yeast eat up any diacetyl and clean up the beer.

 

Then I put the primary (Ale Pail) into the lager fridge for 2 solid weeks, then keg.

 

For my lagers <6%, if the lager tastes good/ready to drink at kegging, it goes on tap as soon as room is available. 

 

Stronger lagers (like the 8% d-bock I kegged last week) will get another 1-2 months in the cold.

Yeah, that sounds reasonable.   I should have mentioned that I typically leave the lager in primary for a total of about 2 weeks.  5 days (ish) cool and the rest warmer.  I will swirl it a few times (when it's warmer) just to make sure the yeast is suspended and doing its work.  That time when the beer is warmer allows everything to settle very nicely... then I keg, chill, gel and carb.  For awhile there my supply was low and 2-3 week-old lager was making it to the taps.  It was "good" but slightly young and slightly cloudy compared to normal timelines.  Yesterday I put a lager on tap that was brewed on 6/30 so it sat in primary for 2 weeks and then lagered for 6 weeks.  It's clear, smooth and ready to go so it seems like some amount of lager time still has its advantages.  



#4 drez77

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 06:19 AM

I'm checking in with those who are making lagers to see what you've been doing with regard to primary.  Are most of you still doing the 4-5 days (or close to 50% of fermentation done) at the lower temp (50° or so) and then taking the primary out of the cool spot to finish up?  This was the "quick lager method" mentioned by numerous popular brewers and just curious who is following this method.  If I have kegs of beer in a queue, they are going to sit cold, kegged and carbed for a good 4-6 weeks most of the time anyway but just curious who is doing this and who is allowing the lager to sit cool during the entire primary time.  I'm still a believer in having the lager warm up for some amount of time to avoid diacetyl.  

Pretty close to what I do.  I let it go about 4-5 days at about 50 and then slowly warm it up over a couple of days with a heating pad. 


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#5 Poptop

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 09:52 AM

I've only lagered with the quick method but I rely on my krauzen rather than gravity readings to feel the halfway mark.  Usually 45-50F for 4 days once the batch takes off and then a raise the temp.  Once final gravity is reached I go to keg where I gel.  I too have noticed that additional time still gets the best out of a lager.  Several of my batches start with a greenish taste if tapped too quickly.  Week three in the keg seems to be my sweet spot that smooths out the mouthfeel, taste and flavor.


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#6 ER Pemberton

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 10:57 AM

I've only lagered with the quick method but I rely on my krauzen rather than gravity readings to feel the halfway mark.  Usually 45-50F for 4 days once the batch takes off and then a raise the temp.  Once final gravity is reached I go to keg where I gel.  I too have noticed that additional time still gets the best out of a lager.  Several of my batches start with a greenish taste if tapped too quickly.  Week three in the keg seems to be my sweet spot that smooths out the mouthfeel, taste and flavor.

Mmm, yeah.  I do go the the full 14-days or so in the primary for two reasons... clearer beer because  the yeast had the chance to settle and more yeast to harvest because it's all sitting at the bottom.  Not very low-O2 of me but I like this approach far better and my results and consistency are excellent.



#7 pkrone

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Posted 30 August 2018 - 04:24 PM

I cold ferment the whole time at 48-50.    Usually spund between day 5 and 10, depending on the speed of the yeast.   Keep the spunded keg at fermenting temp for 2 weeks then put in in the fridge.   Let it sit in the fridge at least 2 weeks. 


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#8 LeftyMPfrmDE

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Posted 31 August 2018 - 07:01 AM

Earlier in the year, i tried the quick lager method with a Helles; 14 days grain to glass- did a quick carb because i was hosting a brew club meeting- wanted to show a clean lager can be turned around on a ale fermentation schedule. It was cloudy, but so damn refreshing; It dropped clear 2 weeks in the keg. It made me a believer in the quick lager method.
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#9 pickle_rick

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Posted 03 September 2018 - 04:25 PM

cool/cold until I see airlock activity slowing down and then I keep ramping to keep things moving along up to the mid 60s.  I have also been fermenting under some pressure and towards the end I crank the pressure up to naturally carb in primary.  once fermentation is complete I crash it for a few days and then transfer to the kegs.  I suppose I could wait longer to get more clearing but I don't mind a little bit of cloudy beer for the first few pours.  still tastes great!


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#10 denny

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Posted 04 September 2018 - 09:03 AM

I'm checking in with those who are making lagers to see what you've been doing with regard to primary.  Are most of you still doing the 4-5 days (or close to 50% of fermentation done) at the lower temp (50° or so) and then taking the primary out of the cool spot to finish up?  This was the "quick lager method" mentioned by numerous popular brewers and just curious who is following this method.  If I have kegs of beer in a queue, they are going to sit cold, kegged and carbed for a good 4-6 weeks most of the time anyway but just curious who is doing this and who is allowing the lager to sit cool during the entire primary time.  I'm still a believer in having the lager warm up for some amount of time to avoid diacetyl.  

 

Still doing the quick method.


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#11 Poptop

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 08:17 AM

I did a quick method with my 70/30 Pilsner/Munich.  It's officially not a quick method since I made it a month ago and it's still in the fermenter haha.  So it goes.  I'll keg it this Saturday :)  I expect that is should have dropped clear by now.  Can't  wait for this one.


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#12 ER Pemberton

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 09:20 AM

I did a quick method with my 70/30 Pilsner/Munich.  It's officially not a quick method since I made it a month ago and it's still in the fermenter haha.  So it goes.  I'll keg it this Saturday :)  I expect that is should have dropped clear by now.  Can't  wait for this one.

Yeah, should be nice and clear.  What I'm seeing with my recent lagers made with the 'quick method' is that they still require some cold lagering time to reach their peak.  When I first heard about the Tasty McDole quick lager method I was under the impression that you could make the beer and keg it within about 2 weeks, chill, carb and drink and then beer would be as good and smooth as one that had been lagered for weeks, months, etc.  I'm not seeing that.  I'm getting good lagers with the quick method but I don't know how "quick" it truly is because there still appears to be a wait for the beer to reach that "beer heaven" stage.  If I put a young lager on tap, it will be a bit cloudy at first (understandable) and slightly "coarse" and muddy in the flavor and finish.  It's good but it's not as good as it could be.  As time goes on the beer clears and the flavor smooths out and everything comes together... and then the keg blows.  :lol:



#13 Poptop

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 09:40 AM

My sentiments on timing and taste exactly.  The initial process through fermentation might speed up but it still takes a good three weeks before the flavors meld into lager love.  Drinkable right out of the gate but a little aging takes away the rough edges or the "coarse and muddy" as you stated.

 

Next up a Saison and then.............  the Staro Prague.  I'm excited for that one.


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#14 ER Pemberton

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 09:46 AM

My sentiments on timing and taste exactly.  The initial process through fermentation might speed up but it still takes a good three weeks before the flavors meld into lager love.  Drinkable right out of the gate but a little aging takes away the rough edges or the "coarse and muddy" as you stated.

 

Next up a Saison and then.............  the Staro Prague.  I'm excited for that one.

I'm in the middle of some ales with 1028.  Then I'm either going to fire up the Staro for some lagers or else I'm going to make some beers with 2112 (a West Coast Lager, a Blonde and maybe some sort of an American Pub Ale/Lager).  I should probably get the Staro fired up since it's a temporary strain.  I have a few recipes ready to go with that yeast.  You will like it.  It's been so long since I used it I can't even remember its character but it's nice for sure.



#15 pickle_rick

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 10:36 AM

I usually find my lagers get about as good as they'll get around 4-5 weeks but after 3 weeks they are often 95% there.
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#16 Poptop

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 11:32 AM

I usually find my lagers get about as good as they'll get around 4-5 weeks but after 3 weeks they are often 95% there.

 

That's a pretty reasonable time no?  That seems to be my sweetspot too.


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#17 pickle_rick

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 01:38 PM

That's a pretty reasonable time no? That seems to be my sweetspot too.


It works for me!
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#18 Merlinwerks

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 01:55 PM

Bayern (OYL-114) is one of my house yeasts now and I ferment at 65F. According to my Tilt hydrometers almost all my beers are finished in 5 - 7 days. Then they are kegged and cold conditioned at 33F for at least 4 weeks.

 

FWIW, I did the same thing with 34/70 but prefer the Bayern...


Edited by Merlinwerks, 08 November 2018 - 01:58 PM.

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