20 replies to this topic

[Kansan]

I am going to do a Flanders Red recipe based off of Jamil's podcast. I am thinking of skipping the 2-3 day 1056 pitch before, and just pitching the Roeselare Blend right off the bat, and letting it go a year or so-- whenever the pelicle decides to fall... Is this approach going to give satisfactory results? Even more pressing on my mind-- I am making an 11 gallon batch and only have 1 Roeselare activator pack! I always make huge starters on a stir plate, but a couple of people have told me no need to with this blend? Yes or no, even with 11 gallons.Any thoughts?

[djinkc]

.........Any thoughts?

No idea, but if consider turning this into a group brew........got an old carboy that just sits there looking at me.

[EWW]

low pitch rate will stress the bugs a bit and give you more sour/funk. First generation R-blend can be week on sour/funk based on my opinion, so if I were you I would probably do the same thing. When you say that you are going to do JZ's method, is that the bucket? I've heard people get better results from Raj's wood stopper method for micro-o2, so I've gone that method myself. Best of luck on the project they are fun to watch. Giver us an update in 1-2 yrs.

[strangebrewer]

low pitch rate will stress the bugs a bit and give you more sour/funk. First generation R-blend can be week on sour/funk based on my opinion, so if I were you I would probably do the same thing. When you say that you are going to do JZ's method, is that the bucket? I've heard people get better results from Raj's wood stopper method for micro-o2, so I've gone that method myself. Best of luck on the project they are fun to watch. Giver us an update in 1-2 yrs.

+1 on everything. I've been doing buckets for the first 6 months and then moving to glass with the wooden dowel and had good success.I wouldn't brew 11 gallons of any sour personally. What I have been doing is brewing 5 gallons of a sour every 6 months so that when I rack the first one out of primary I've got a fresh 5 gallons to toss on the funk cake. I love sour beers as they are a real treat to me but having more than 5 gallons of any one specific sour is overkill for me. I prefer the variety.

[Kansan]

+1 on everything. I've been doing buckets for the first 6 months and then moving to glass with the wooden dowel and had good success.I wouldn't brew 11 gallons of any sour personally. What I have been doing is brewing 5 gallons of a sour every 6 months so that when I rack the first one out of primary I've got a fresh 5 gallons to toss on the funk cake. I love sour beers as they are a real treat to me but having more than 5 gallons of any one specific sour is overkill for me. I prefer the variety.

I am the same way, but have to keep my brew partner happy too! This is all going into a 14g glass carboy with the wooden dowl method that raj writes about (having it dip into the beer does freak me out a bit),

[strangebrewer]

I am the same way, but have to keep my brew partner happy too! This is all going into a 14g glass carboy with the wooden dowl method that raj writes about (having it dip into the beer does freak me out a bit),

The oak dowel is a little freaky until you start to understand what's going on in the beer. Just make sure you've got room for the wood to expand as it will and if it is jammed in the neck it will crack the carboy. I'd hate to see a 14 gallon demijohn busted!Funky beers are a good time but patience is everything. Enjoy!

[HVB]

As for a starter and Rosalare. I read that you should not make a starter because the brewers yeast and the bugs will not propagate at the same rate. It is best to just pitch the pacakge. Can anyone comment on this?

[strangebrewer]

As for a starter and Rosalare. I read that you should not make a starter because the brewers yeast and the bugs will not propagate at the same rate. It is best to just pitch the pacakge. Can anyone comment on this?

This is accurate. Saccharomyces is about all that will really propagate in a starter made a week in advance. Saccharomyces and lactobacillus are the only 2 organisms in the blend that have a short lag. When Sacc is present Brett and Pedio will both take 30-60 days before they start to show themselves. So unless you're planning your starter a month in advance of brewing I wouldn't bother.

[HVB]

This is accurate. Saccharomyces is about all that will really propagate in a starter made a week in advance. Saccharomyces and lactobacillus are the only 2 organisms in the blend that have a short lag. When Sacc is present Brett and Pedio will both take 30-60 days before they start to show themselves. So unless you're planning your starter a month in advance of brewing I wouldn't bother.

What is your feeling/opinion on re-using Roaslare? I have a flanders brown that I plan to keg soon and I wasn thinking about using part of hte slurry for a flanders red.

[strangebrewer]

What is your feeling/opinion on re-using Roaslare? I have a flanders brown that I plan to keg soon and I wasn thinking about using part of hte slurry for a flanders red.

I haven't had a chance to reuse the Rosalare blend yet but I am planning on it. The part I am still debating is if I want to re-pitch a Sacc strain when I throw the next batch on the funk cake. After 6 months in primary I'm thinking all of the Sacc will have been cannibalized. Though that is just a gut feeling from what I have observed.

[Jimmy James]

FWIW I brewed the Wild Brews recipe and it turned out freaking awesome. The key to these is really to keep your mits off them for at least a year. I went the bucket route and let it sit for 6 months, then bottled and let the bottles age another 6 months to a year. I haven't tried the oak dowel method yet, but the flavor/funk/aroma I got from going 6 months in the bucket was spot on compared to the commercial examples I've had. I think that wyeast blend is the shiz. I think the oak would just add even more goodness potentially. Next time I may do that, or go closer to 9 months in the bucket with a couple oak cubes thrown in.

[siouxbrewer]

I make a starter with my Roeselare smacker, understanding that the bugs will prop at different rates, because I prefer a good amount of sour. The bacteria will reproduce faster than the sacch or brett giving them a jump start on their acid production cycles. I'm not really looking for full attenuation from the sacch strain; I want acid production before the Lacto shuts down due to alcohol production from the yeast. Any residual sugars after primary is complete will be consumed slowly, in the presence of oxygen, by the brett. I ferment in HDPE barrels which have a high oxygen permeability. After primary is over I seal the container completely and only allow oxygen to permeate through the walls of the vessel. I have also repitched my yeast cake and have had more sour results, quicker. I have a dedicated fermenter for such projects, and 12 gals of Flanders anything isn't too much

[EWW]

What is your feeling/opinion on re-using Roaslare? I have a flanders brown that I plan to keg soon and I wasn thinking about using part of hte slurry for a flanders red.

I'm on my 4th batch from the first yeast pack. I add about a 1/2 cup per 5 gallons. Flanders red/brown are basically the same beer IMHO. If you want to try something different try a blonde they turn out really nice.

[HVB]

I'm on my 4th batch from the first yeast pack. I add about a 1/2 cup per 5 gallons. Flanders red/brown are basically the same beer IMHO. If you want to try something different try a blonde they turn out really nice.

That is good information. Belgian blonde or American blonde? Always looking to have more sours around the house.

[EWW]

That is good information. Belgian blonde or American blonde? Always looking to have more sours around the house.

I did something around 1.050 OG with 70% Pils, 20-25% wheat, and 5-10% of a light crystal. Keep the hops low (12-17 IBU) and Noble-ish in character and you should be good to go.

[Kansan]

Thanks for all the responses guys. The kettles will be fired up tomorrow afternoon-- with just the Roeselare pitched, kept around 70 deg F, and shoving a rod in the bung! I'll keep you posted... in about a year from now.

[siouxbrewer]

... shoving a rod in the bung!

You guys over at Yellowstone redefine the term "brewing partner" Seriously, hope you have a great brew day, I'd stop by but I'm brewing up something hoppy myself. BTW we need to do a sour tasting SOON.

[EWW]

Thanks for all the responses guys. The kettles will be fired up tomorrow afternoon-- with just the Roeselare pitched, kept around 70 deg F, and shoving a rod in the bung! I'll keep you posted... in about a year from now.

no one really mentioned it here, but you want the wood for the O2 and not the woodiness. Boil the wood in water for a good while to leach out some of the oak character. This will also help the wood expand and reduce the risk of a cracked carboy neck.