12 replies to this topic

[3rd party JKor]

I've never oaked anything, but I want to do it soon. I have no clue how to select what oak to use. Chips? Cubes? American? French? Light? Medium? Heavy? I'm clueless. Help me.

[jayb151]

Honestly I've only oaked a few beers and each time it was with Heavy toast, American Cubes. I LOVE the flavor I get from it. I put it in a bourbon oak RIS and (although different) I felt the flavor and mouthfeel was similar to Goose Island Bourbon County Stout. I personally wouldn't recommend the chips. from what I have read, they impart all their flavor quickly and lead to a harsher oak. While cubes take time to soak and lead to a more mellow, but pronounced flavor. Also, American oak has about twice the amount of tannins as French. So, If you are looking for the most mellow of oak, I would get some medium toast, French oak cubes.If you're doing a RIS, I think almost any kind of oak would work, but you should taste it as it goes to know when to take it off oak. Thats one flavor that ussually doesn't fade...at least not quickly. I used 2 oz of Heavy American cubes in my RIS. It sat for probably a month too, and I still felt like it could have used more oak! Good Luck!JayB

[Thirsty]

I have done an RIS with both American and French oak, I like the french the best. HB Emporium in W Boylston has a # of french oak cubes for $8, I would check that out. 2 oz is all you need, 3-4 weeks inparts a good flavor but check at 2.

[strangebrewer]

I have done an RIS with both American and French oak, I like the french the best. HB Emporium in W Boylston has a # of french oak cubes for $8, I would check that out. 2 oz is all you need, 3-4 weeks inparts a good flavor but check at 2.

I know it's purely subjective but what is it you liked in the French oak over the American oak? I've done this experiment myself in a RIS and personally preferred the heavy char American oak. IMO it's all about what you like. In the medium to heavy char from French oak I pull more spice and dark fruit, Hungarian I pull vanilla/roast coffee, and American I pull more smokey/coffee. In both the Hungarian and American oak I get more mouth feel out of the finished product as well. I don't get that effect from the French oak. So depending on the starting RIS I'd cater my oak to fit.

[Winkydowbrewing]

Hey Jay,Ive got a # of some variety, unopened which I doubt I will ever use. I forget exactly which variety it is, but if you want it let me know and I find out what type it is. Could even run it out your way as I will have lots of free time after today. PM me if your interested.

[Stout_fan]

TBN Session has an episode on oaking, different roasts, types of oak, cubes vs. chips.really covered the subject well.

[Thirsty]

I know it's purely subjective but what is it you liked in the French oak over the American oak? I've done this experiment myself in a RIS and personally preferred the heavy char American oak.

The American I got some fruits out of and very weak vanilla, cherries, dates, figs type dark fruits. It added complexity, but didnt have a popping oak flavor, which it did when I first transferred- mellowed out a lot. The French gave me very little fruit, but a bit of vanilla and an almost bitter strong oak flavor, and the aroma was much more intense. The last one I also backed off the mash down to 150, making it more quaffable and less in your face syrupy and chewy. It took first place in the last comp I entered it in, and made it to be 5th in the BOS before it got kicked out. When it was first judged in the morning it got passed around the room as a "must try" I had to of course remain annonymous to be impartial. Ironically the judge who narrowed it down to out it in the end commented on it being dry, the other judges backed it up though. So your point is very well taken- it is all subjective.

[3rd party JKor]

Hey Jay,Ive got a # of some variety, unopened which I doubt I will ever use. I forget exactly which variety it is, but if you want it let me know and I find out what type it is. Could even run it out your way as I will have lots of free time after today. PM me if your interested.

I haven't brewed the RIS yet, so it will probably be a few months, but I might take you up on that offer.

[ChefLamont]

Another guy on the board here, gnef, will oak just about anything that is not nailed down (and that is one of the many things I like about him). One of the advantages of this is that he has split batches and done some side by side oakings with different kinds. Of the ones I have had I like the Hungarian medium toast the best. It had a very firm vanilla/wood character but yet still smooth without super long aging. Or that is what I remember. He doesnt often subscribe to the single digit ABV theory.

[Thirsty]

Another guy on the board here, gnef, will oak just about anything that is not nailed down He doesnt often subscribe to the single digit ABV theory.

That reminds me, we haven't done a board swap in a couple months, maybe its time!

[gnef]

Eh? You called?I have used American, Hungarian, and French in beers, meads, and wines. I have yet to try it with cider, not sure about the flavor combination, but will probably give it a try.I only use the medium toast - I consider it to be a good all around char, at least for me. I also buy it by the pound, and I am not going to buy a pound of each different char of each locality.In my beers, I usually only use the American, and leave what I consider the more delicate flavors from the hungarian and french for my meads where the oak can shine more. I do an annual batch of traditional meads, splitting it into three kegs, and add american to one, hungarian to one, and french to one. I want to do a vertical taste test in 5-10 years from each year, and of each type of oak, which I think will give a good idea of the different types of oak, and how each oak ages.My policy with oaking, is use a small amount, and leave it in the keg forever until the keg empties. This is not typical from what I have read others doing, but feel it works well for me. I do this for a couple reasons, the first being I am lazy and forgetful, and wanted a method that wouldn't completely destroy months of work and the cost of a big beer or mead. Also, the flavor that is extracted from oak changes with time, so the longer you leave it with the oak, the greater the complexity you gain from the oak. I usually use at maximum 1.5oz of oak in a 5 gallon batch, and that will only be for a beer or mead that I know can handle it, I usually only use 1oz or .75oz per 5 gallon batch.Also, I do not soak my oak cubes in anything, except for a quick dip in starsan before it goes into the keg. I know some soak it in whiskey or vodka, I'd rather just let the beer work with the oak directly.Like others have said, much of this is personal preference, and I am sure you will come up with your own methods that work best for you and your taste, and I hope some of what is said here will help you along your own journey. Let us know what you decide to do, your results, and things that you might change for your next batch.

[cavman]

I've been thinking of charring an oak dowel, to use in bugged beers then store it in a pvc tube with late runnings and letting the bugs mature. I would then use this as my way of introducing bugs to the beers that need them, it will be part of my American WIld series that is in the early stages.